Earlier today, I sent a message to kleinbl00, one of the apparently chosen Gods of Hubski. I have complained about him to multiple people before in PM, but I decided to just mute him and tell him directly why.
You can read that here. I had originally decided not to be that asshole, but I'm leaving, and I've read enough complaints about Klein here and elsewhere to feel justified in posting it.
I knew going in that Klein would only respond in a self-glorifying egomaniacal way, and I was right.
You can read his response here. The "PS" was a link to a short I posted here a while back - don't mind the overly-obvious passive aggressive included. Also don't mind his blatant "this is the size of my dick" measuring.
What I find sad is that so many people have apparently sent him the same e-mail. Instead of improving himself or trying not be an unwelcoming person, he's instead "crafted a boilerplate" passive aggressive, condescending response.
This is not the sort of person I want to share a community with. It is not a person I will be a serf of, as if I lived in feudal Japan.
He is right, to an extent. His name is all over this site. For some reason, he's glorified. I have no idea why.
As I posted earlier today to flagamuffin, Hubski is not a place for intelligent discussion. It has good days, and some of you are fantastic people, but you are out voiced.
Hubski is Klein's, as he so politely points out, "I'm still all over this site. I get 3-4 shout-outs a day. I have nearly a thousand followers. So if I'm the one thing keeping you from enjoying Hubski, best bail now, son... 'cuz you'll have an easier time getting the chocolate out of a Chips Ahoy."
Hubski isn't your's. It's his. And if he doesn't like you, you'd better "bail."
So that's what I'm doing. Hubski could be better, but it won't be, because it doesn't want to be. There's no reason for me to participate here. I want to, because with the exception of Klein, I enjoy the community. But I won't put up with being chased around and shouted down at every opportunity.
bolds are notes that I added after writing it initially Alright. I'm hungover as balls. I'm upset that I'm too hungover to enjoy Halloween again tonight. I'm mad that it fucking downpoured last night and I was stuck in Hollywood...in the rain....with 10,000 other people trying to get Uber/Lyft/Cabs/etc. I'm pissed that the cab ride we finally got cost us $106. I'm really upset that the costume I spent 2 full weeks creating and sewing (I don't even know how to sew!) was worn for 6 hours total and is now soggy. And now I am sad and mad about this. The shallow, hungover side of me wants to respond "oh fuck off", hide it from my feed, and not deal with it. This is the third post in as many months that address similar themes in similar tones. All have left me feeling increasingly shitty and concerned. One thing that worries me is that this is suddenly a pattern. I'm not sure if these posts are partially the result of the previous posts - are they like suicides, where one person jumps from the 18th floor of the library, and suddenly everyone decides to kill themselves by jumping from the 18th floor of the library? But, one person jumping doesn't cause everyone to jump - individuals still independently, and for their own reasons, decide to die. The pattern only lies in the method. Which is why it's not okay for me / us not deal with this. Obviously, something is going on that is causing people to feel this way. Even if I don't agree with and don't respect the choice to antagonistically and selfishly peace out in this manner, I'm going to do my best to understand what is causing people to feel like this. You can't keep going if there is a problem and you can't fix the problem without knowing what the problem is. Just like em's post. Just like the last post of someone leaving. I'm going to start by saying: TLDR: YOU HAVE VALID POINTS You have some valid points. Hubski is not perfect. Hubski does not perfectly encapsulate "a place for thoughtful discussion" all of the time. Sidenote: I'm not sure when the tagline became something that people are are using as evidence that Hubski is a failure. It's what Hubski aspires to be. It's what Hubski's goal is, has always been, and will always be. Perhaps it should be more explicit: "Hubski: where we try to be the place for thoughtful discussion but utterly fail.) TLDR: INSOM GET ALL SELFISH AND TALKS ABOUT HERSELF I'm also going to explain something not everyone knows. A while back, I fucking blew up at kb. It was not one of my finest moments. It was pretty terrible, and I managed to let loose on a comment of his that definitely didn't deserve it. (like...seriously...I could've picked any other comment and, while it wouldn't have justified the way I handled the situation, it would have at least made a tiny bit of sense. Nope. I like to do things the retarded way.) But at that time, I shared some of your sentiments about kb. I thought it was deliberately and purposefully pissing people off. I imagined he survived exclusively by drinking fat glasses of malice and I saw each comment as a steaming stream of malice piss... all over my face.
TLDR: KB AINT TRYING TO BE A DICK (usually) While my attack on kb was pretty much uncalled for on every level, the reasons I felt the way I felt about him were even more wrong. I can say, without a doubt, that kb does not write comments to piss you off. He does not get off on being a dick to you. A majority of the time, he doesn't even mean to be a dick. (There are times when he does - but they are blatantly obvious and usually short and sweet. They are also usually in response to people being dicks, or being outstandingly stupid and not even trying to not be stupid.) I will agree that kb likes to debate/argue/instigate/etc and once in a debate, he likes to win. He's also good at it, which is probably related to why he likes it so much. I like winning too. If I had any motivation, I would read the books he's recommended - or persuasion and anything else. (you're going to have to google site:hubski.com kleinbl00 books and start making a list.) At least then I would be armed with more than my 24 year old emotions before meddling with the devil on his home court. TLDR: HEY WHY DON'T YOU TRY SOMETHING THAT MIGHT HELP YOUR SANITY SINCE KB IS SO BAD Alas, I had no motivation and I found it much more productive and stress-free to simply not read every comment of his like he intended to piss you off. If you read them with the same respect you evidently feel that you deserve, you might find his tone is not as aggressive, combative, or personal as you make them. I know that simple change on my part allowed me to be more open minded, realize that kb is actually a pretty cool guy with a lot of crazy valuable insights, and actually will go out of his way to educate, discuss, and be helpful if you communicate with him. (Actually, even if you don't communicate with him. I think I have a still have a string of notes that I meant to respond to and never did....oops. Sorry kb!) TLDR: HEY MAYBE KB REALLY IS A DICK TO YOU AND IM TOTALLY WRONG. (really - skip this part I'm only keeping it because it took me a lot of time) You made it fucking difficult to find the shit you referenced when you deleted your account. I managed to find the latest movie thread, where he didn't respond to you...not even once. 1. I went through every single movie post tagged #movieclub and did a search for both "user-" and "klein". I found zero interaction...ever. 2. I did google search for hubski and your name and pulled up every page that google has indexed, and then searched for "klein". I found one interaction, from 106 days ago (you joined the site 155 days ago): https://hubski.com/pub?id=166843 Reading that thread, I see a fucking boatload of snark and instigation coming from you. Like...holy shit: If you had responded to my points in that way, I would have gotten very agitated with you. I'm surprised that KB's responses were as mellow as they were. I was expected to find a battle. I found him making a few concise points with only one line that is not as concise, but not exactly earth-shatteringly snarky or aggressive: "The choice is simple: Are you willing to abase yourself enough to bridge the gap of discussion? Then do so. Would you rather sit in your castle of high dudgeon maintaining that you have no need to apologize? Then accept that you've been muted." (I'm curious if KB had muted you at this point and was using you to literally or if he was using you as a general pronoun? Based on the entire context, I am 99% sure its the latter and this may your first interaction with him.) 3. I then went through KBs comments for the last 50 days. proof This is the ONLY INTERACTION BETWEEN YOU AND HIM IN THE LAST 50 days (besides the relationship post) here.: Debate about NaNoWriMo where kb covers NaNoWriMo in a pile of shit --- [KB attacks 8bit: "Never ask your parents or your friends for an honest opinion about your writing." :( 8bit: "Why ya gotta stunt on a brotha like that, Klein." Klein admits he's truly in love with Hubskina.}(https://hubski.com/pub?id=185751) :) ---- KB attacks NaNoWriMo with stats ---- You say why you write NaNoWriMo, agree with his thoughts on NaNo, disagree on...um....I'm not sure honestly --- but then we end up at one lined snarkies by both sides -> you dont want to debate it further (what debate?) -> kb, "understand if I didn't give a shit about you and your writing, I wouldn't give a shit about this." -> you "I have no plans to mute you. I disagree with you, and that's the end of it" -> HUGGIES! -------note: the above love from kb directly contradicts this statement you make: "and you definitely don’t care about the person to which you’re responding." I don't even know if that's you. I hope its not serial lurker confusing me again. :( TLDR: CONCLUSION: I'VE FOUND 2 INTERACTIONS IN LAST 50 DAYS, AND ONCE 100 DAYS AGO, BOTH WEREN'T ANYWHERE CLOSE TO WHAT YOU MADE IT SEEM LIKE WITH YOUR POST . Granted, if he responded to you and you never responded back, it wouldn't show up in my "user-" search on his comment page. So if that's the case and kb is literally commenting on your comments and posts incessantly and insulting you, I apologize. I truly don't think that's the case though. and now I am upset for an entirely new reason. Because you just made this fucking post and rage quit on us. I went and spent a good amount of time trying to figure out where the issues were, why we have people quitting on us like this, and what the fuck is going on. I wanted to know why Hubski is suddenly a place for not thoughtful discussion. What I found was that there is literally no evidence backing up your claims that KB is a dick to you, is everywhere, and is ruining your experience. Nor that hubski doesn't want to be thoughtful. I thought there were problems and omg the world might end. I feel deceived, and exhausted. Fuck you. Just kidding. Interacting with people is what you make it. Hubski is what you make it. Somehow, you seem to have become obsessed with kb and perhaps it is this obsession that has caused you to think that he has invaded your space and is inescapable.* He is not. He does not dominate Hubski, as much as his follower count would lead you to believe. he average share of Kb's posts are no higher than any other active user who has been on the site for a bit. He may comment more and comment longer, but I don't see how his comments lead you to be unable to comment as well. I mean...just read the post and comment, man. Don't get all wrapped up in kb's comments. Being obsessed with KB is a fairly typical thing - I wouldn't recommend asking _refugee_ for advice on how to not be obsessed with him, but perhaps you can start a kb-obsessed support group or something? The fact that he doesn't seem to respond to you as much as you've lead us to believe also makes it very hard for me to understand the line about "...But I won't put up with being chased around and shouted down at every opportunity" I was genuinely concerned that kb may have turned into a rapist. But I think ref's point, "This reminds me, uncomfortably, of people who tell women to smile more....." is pretty spot on. The fact that you are the one who is publicly defacing kb shows a lot about your character. This line doesn't make any sense to me: " It's a real shame that good people can do a single thing that will forever change the way people perceive them and remember them. Frankly, I found you to be a cool guy and welcomed another developer on Hubski. I enjoyed the myriad of threads that we had that went for days (sometimes because I forgot to respond - other times because we just wandered about the conversation). As much as I'll try to remember those times and not this post when I think about you, the reality is is that this post carries much more weight as it is charged with emotion. Everything about this sucks...and it's raining again. Ah well... all those moments will be lost...like tears in rain and shit.It's that easy, but don't worry yourself over the fact that it makes no sense.
This is why I stopped trying to have a conversation with you. For irony, I'll go ahead and mute you. I know it won't prove my point to you, but clearly you're incapable of understanding it anyway.
Hubski could be better, but it won't be, because it doesn't want to be. There's no reason for me to participate here. I want to, because....I enjoy the community. But I won't...
" Why isn't there a reason for you to participate here? What are you trying to get out of Hubski? Do you not see yourself as providing valuable insights to Hubski? Do you not think you are getting enough attention? My turn to be selfish and melodramatic: if you enjoy it and gave a shit about any of us, why did you leave, especially in this fashion?
To me, this post and posts like it seem to be coming from users who joined in "The Wave of Mute-ilation" (or whatever we're calling that). Anyway, lots of focus on cliques and powerusers. In any conversation, certain voices will dominate. Bein considerate to the less vociferous can only help so much. In other words, I think people need to stop assuming that their voice will be valued as much as any other on the internet, because that's not how human interactions work. Charisma matters everywhere and no, "goodbye cruel world" posts are not a solution. By the way, this DST shit . . . (yes, I am almost 30) this means I have to wake up earlier, right?
That costume is the shit, dude. Honestly though Klein has got me feeling more personally attacked than the dude that made this post right now with his straight up Hubskina hate. So you know what fuck it goodbye Hubski, thanks for trying, I'm gonna go to giant parties and bitch about them now (and again)
Which is why it's not okay for me / us not deal with this. Obviously, something is going on that is causing people to feel this way. Even if I don't agree with and don't respect the choice to antagonistically and selfishly peace out in this manner, I'm going to do my best to understand what is causing people to feel like this. You can't keep going if there is a problem and you can't fix the problem without knowing what the problem is. While in general I greatly appreciate your hard work and dedication to hubski, I suggest that this is one area you should just let lie. There is just a certain kind of person that goes out like this and it's way easier to let em go than to fix them. There are enough of us here that we are bound to get a nice chuck of drama loving "look at meeee's" knocking over the lamps, drinking too much and telling us "how they really feel," and that's OK. If you are lucky they burn out quick.One thing that worries me is that this is suddenly a pattern. I'm not sure if these posts are partially the result of the previous posts - are they like suicides, where one person jumps from the 18th floor of the library, and suddenly everyone decides to kill themselves by jumping from the 18th floor of the library? But, one person jumping doesn't cause everyone to jump - individuals still independently, and for their own reasons, decide to die. The pattern only lies in the method.
I agree with you 100%. I tried not to revise my comment too much (notice how it's way too long) after I looked into his specific grievances more closely. One reason is because it accurately reflects how I initially felt and what I immediately thought when I saw his post and there is something to that. Another reason is because the comment gets increasingly mean and snippy as I wrote it and I don't want you all to think I'm a mean person! I'm good! I swear! I try to take a good, hard, objective look (try!) at Hubski every once in a while because I don't want to miss something that was blatantly obvious to everyone except us long time, acclimated, kick ass Hubski users. Once you "get" Hubski, you tend to stick around for a long time and love it. It's easy to miss things. When I see things like this, I assume that it is worth listening to. Maybe asking things like, "do they have a point? is that how non-Hubski users generally see it? Are new users scared away by the people? or the global feed? are we accidentally exclusionary to all people, or just dimwits? Can we do anything to change that? Is is worth changing? Why? Is there any validity to their point? Is there a common point being brought up again and again? " I looked deeply at this post, went back through the others, checked a couple things, and surprise! they're all dead fucking wrong. Just kidding. They are have different problems and issues with Hubski and there are very few common elements between them all. Some seem to be caused by lack of interest in change (i like where I am even though I bitch about it constantly), not being motivated to change (aww but I already got my bookbars bar set up...), or needing to be sold to on what Hubski can provide them rather than checking it out themselves. Some seem to be seeking attention, some are obviously people like to be cool and hate on everything, some seem to be too hipster for Hubski (it's been around for more than a year...Imma do Ello...that shit is so fresh I'll be the oldest Elllo user soon!) and others not hipster enough (I only do things that are cool before they are cool once brooklynveganpapstdrinker.com tells me they're cool...or not cool..wait...). One common one is a better mobile experience (we're working on it! keep your pants on!). But yeah. Not going to start catering to this type of stuff or changing things because of one or even two users grievances. Also, to any random readers of this thread who are doing research for your own ragequit post, please don't do it. Don't be that asshole. And certainly don't say that you don't want to be that asshole and go and be that asshole anyways. That's silly. Message me. I'll give you a full length comment as a personal mail message to you. Poor chatter readers don't want to sift through my shit anymore.
1. We neeeeeed the rain. 2. It still amazes me how concise and eloquent y'all motherfuckers can be even when writing a lot/drunk/hung ov/emotionally charged. 3. I admit I was obsessed with k for a minute 'cause he sounded much smahter than me when he replied to a comment and that can be infuriating when you feel more comfortable following certain internet trialogue edicate. Wanting to make the insightful yet just-pithy-enough response, I'm always afraid of someone calling me out on my bulsh and I'm still shocked when they do and I get defensive and paranoid. 4. Now in my experience, we're all just talking to ourselves, trying to convince yourself through others. But online you have time to edit and review your entries, creating a persona that doesn't really reflect the much of the real you. Or maybe showing who you want to be is actually more telling of yourself.
Haha! I try...I try...Expectations are high on Hubski. I like it because it forces me to be better... no matter how shitty I feel. Are you in LA as well? It's suddenly freezing! NOoooooooo! I was just at the beach last week! Come back summer!
For my hubskiing, yes. General productivity, no. Today, I'm playing catch up on a pile of code and a pile of laundry that will have me up until about 3am again.
My obsessing is very low key obsessing. :) it even allows room for disagreement and pissed-in-Cheerios sorts of mornings. That's a thing I find about kb important to remember. If he sounds pissed off go and reread your shit and see what pissed him off and respond to that. Respond to the point. keep it about the talk
Then why did you bother? You knew you would not receive a satisfying response but just one that would incite further unhappiness. Congrats, you were right, no one is surprised. This reminds me, uncomfortably, of people who tell women to smile more. " kleinbl00, you're not nice enough for me. You have to become nicer until I'm satisfied with how nice you are." If he is nice, that's nice, that helps new users assimilate, but he's hardly the only person (in fact I would posit one of the more rare persons) with whom new users interact. Klein avoids new users. As for his name being everywhere, well, yeah. So's mine. Does that make me a Hubski god? I'm less active than klein but if we're honest, not really by that much. As you say, you've received PMs complaining about Klein, so therefore his name being all over the site doesn't represent what percentage of the population likes him. This is stupid, and it's fear-mongering. Why does Hubski have to be anyone's? How can Hubski be any one person's? Why are we being presented with this false dichotomy of us vs. them? Why are we being presented with this false concept of Hubski ownership? Is it because you feel owned? I've done enough research into your interactions with klein on Hubski to say that it ain't being represented accurately in your letter. Unless comments have been deleted, movie club posts were improperly tagged, or I totally missed something, you and klein have never interacted directly in Movie Club posts and in fact only interacted once, through me, when he seconded my ask that we NOT watch Gravity. Which reminds me. How come no one yells at me for arguing with them? How come no one posts about me? Was I not a dick when I referred to Hubski in general as "you fuckers" especially since it was clear that what I meant was the guy I was arguing with was a fucker? That brings me to another point. I'm pretty blatant with my opinion when I have a strong one and I stand my ground. Just this week I've been straight dismissive of submissions on more than one occasion. I haven't even always been good at fostering an intelligent discussion with these comments, although I've gone back and expounded where I thought it would be elucidating. No one's bitching at me, am I just not being offensive enough? Everyone doesn't get along with everyone. But for some reason the people who unfollow or mute me don't feel the need to tell me about it. And I don't think they have any obligation to do so because it's their choice. And if they decided to mute me, I'd figure that was okay, because it meant that we probably wouldn't enjoy speaking to each other any way. It's like the dating game but with social interactions. Do you know who you should desire to interact with least in social networks? The people who don't want to interact with you. What is so hard about trusting someone's judgment when they decide they don't want to talk to you? You decided to initiate a conversation with a user about how you did not want to have conversations with them. Do you see how that is circular? From the get-go it is a bad set up because you are initiating an action you said you no longer wanted to experience. You and klein have interacted in something like 5-10 comment threads in the past 10-ish months. That ain't bein' chased and shouted down at every opportunity. I'm a wizard, 'Arry, and I know enough about the internet to check these sorts of things out on a rudimentary level. It ain't hard. I grant that you may feel, perhaps, prosecuted and targeted. I am sure however that you are not. EDIT: Also, like, nice way to try to guilt Hubski-as-a-whole into taking your side by implying that the site as a whole fails because you are unable to get along with another user, who you actually instigated into having the conversation that is leading to your departure with. I knew going in that Klein would only respond in a self-glorifying egomaniacal way
Instead of improving himself or trying not be an unwelcoming person, he's instead "crafted a boilerplate" passive aggressive, condescending response.
Hubski isn't your's. It's his. And if he doesn't like you, you'd better "bail."
Over the last week I’ve been thinking heavily about dropping Hubski because of how you behave. Specifically, your posts in the Movie Club - something I can’t participate in because you’re constantly arguing with me any time I post.
My favorite part was when somebody told him that he should crosspost it into /r/drama and he said he wasn't interested in dealing with it. If...if you weren't interested in dealing with it, why are you airing your dirty laundry around. These is like highschool levels of drama. I hate the internet sometimes, why do people take it so seriously.
I was afraid that "CG" stood for "cgod". You can imagine my relief at seeing your post here.
I'm really uncomfortable with the public posting of private messages. Unless you and kb agreed that it was okay to do so.
I have 10 more followers than kleinbl00, I post a hell of a lot more, I comment more often and chances are, I get more shout outs. This isn't me "measuring my dick," this isn't me suggesting that I'm more important around here, than him or anyone else. In fact, it's the opposite. What I'm about to suggest is that if I were to leave Hubski, it would still be a special place because of the totality of the community and to an extent, the tools that the site provides. There have been several times when I have gone away for a week or so and guess what? The site still kicks ass. There have been stretches or up to 6 months where KB has left the site and guess what? The site still kicked ass. Hubski is bigger than one user, bigger than me, KB, mk or whatever new awesome person joins next week and makes a large impact. As for our PM that you reference, I now feel obligated to share my response publicly. This is fine, as it's the same response I'd give most people that approached me with a personal issue with another community member:Dude, I dig you cashewguy and I dig kb and I have zero to do with this and haven't read the conversation or post. But do what you want to do and if there's a failing in the tools we provide, let me know.
Nice to see you are using "dark" though. How do you like it as a setting? I just switched to "spring" the other day. WOW, it's a helluva difference. Like switching from hubskiing with Tom Waits to Papa Smurf.
I think is the one thing that people who negatively perceive challenges to their worldview can't get their head around. You can get so used to having others just politely accept/not care about your opinions, that it's a shock to the system almost. You're not used to having to re-evaluate your views. Then you come up against the roadblock: forming a grounded and informed opinion and/or argument that you can eloquently communicate is hard. It takes, among other things, time, education, open-mindedness, work, constant revision, and commitment. Some just can't get over that wall. Which is a shame when you have people who can make an argument as well as kleinbl00. It's only in the last month or so that I've grown to truly appreciate that. For my masters we're given a paper week which we then have to come in and discuss and critique for a 2 hour session. The professor heads the session, but we're expected to a majority of discussion amongst ourselves. Those are intense sessions. You think you have a grip, then the professor throws in some crazy theoretical knowledge or applies something seemingly unrelated to completely change the playing field. It's impressive and inspiring. They're fast becoming my favourite.Me challenging your ideas delivers you a fuckload more benefits than it does me.
This perfectly describes every comment that I've posted to the internet. I'm pretty much like, let's dance in circles and hope the audience gets something from it, because I'm more confused than when I started. I have immense respect for people who make a point and get my brain racing in 10-15 lines. What are you getting your masters in? I want to hear more about these sessions! It sounds like it would be so enlightening, terrifying, and exhausting.Then you come up against the roadblock: forming a grounded and informed opinion and/or argument that you can eloquently communicate is hard
I'm doing my masters in music composition. The sessions are part of a module called 'Critique of Research' and at the end we have to write an essay exploring and linking together common themes or ideas from within all the texts we have been given. Some of the papers we have been been over so far include: - Milton Babbit's "Who Cares if You Listen?" where he states that for the composer to truly advance his art and music in general, he must withdraw himself and work/showcase his work in complete isolation from the public. - Nicholas Cook's "Music as Performance" which seeks to redefine the performance of a score from a musicology perspective. He argues that the performance is essentially a work of a art in itself, separate from the original score. The score merely acts as a script, and rather than the performance being compared to the score, it should be compared to all performance that have come before and after. I laid those out just to give you an idea of the kind of thing we're dealing with. We're expected to read the papers, and make notes. We enter the session, and the professor says "What did you think?". This is usually followed by silence until someone dares to break it. But from then on it usually flow reasonably well. If the silence ever peaks then that's when the professor will throw in a new question or some relevant literature. He has points which he hopes we'll hit, which he then has further reading for us to explore on our own. You're right with your presumption, it is enlightening, terrifying, and exhausting. Trying to simultaneously figure out and form a coherent opinion is taxing to say the least. More often than not, you come out with more questions than you went in with. The points within the papers often run far deeper than you could have of ever imagined. I just discovered that the paper I have to read for Thursday is 35 pages long, so I better get started!- Glenn Gould's "Prospects of Performance", in which he posits that the advent of recording has made live performance of music obsolete. By his estimate, the intimate nature of the 'private audition' when listening at home exceeds the concert. He also discusses how the advent of recording allows for a more genuine product.
I didn't know you were M.Mus in Comp, rezzeJ! cool. I actually just posted about Glenn Gould about 5 minutes ago. edit: also, Milton Babbit is almost as bad as Boethius, imo.
I think it's funny how we all see "user-inactivated", but the tag of "hubski.CashewGuy" hangs in immortality. Food for thought, mk... I'm not knocking the current methodology, just wanted to draw some attention and let you brood on it. P.S. holy hell, I really do fucking love this place, sorry CashewDude, even though I respected the shit out of you.
Thanks. We noted it, and actually, as of last night we decided to let the rewrite take care of it rather than make the fix in this version that will be replaced. We will squash critical bugs, but we are approaching that point where time invested in the current app is often outweighed by implementing the solution on the new version.
Why tag everyone to involve them in a problem you have with one dude?
Using this account only because if you're going to air dirty laundry, at least air the boilerplate. mk - I thought the whole point of shout-outs while muted was to "invite the vampire in." When did that change?
I have no opinion one way or another on why the guy left, seemed over the top to be honest. kleinbl00 I did find your article very interesting though and I seem to remember either reading it or something similar you posted way way back. One thing that strikes me is that, by your own explanation, you have an online persona that communicates with other online personas in a completely different manner to your offline life. I say personas rather than persons because from your perspective, you don't know the other person, you only know what they have written and you speak (discuss, argue, educate, annihilate) directly to that rather than the person behind it. I would guess this comes about from being a very active member of several online communities for a long period of time. You have an evolved sense of online self which I would guess is not the case with many of those you interact with. From my own perspective this is not how I or indeed many others view their "online persona". For some our online personas are simply an extension of our offline personalities, We try to communicate online exactly as we do in real life. For some others they have an even less sophisticated online self which, due to the de-inhibiting nature of anonymity results in them becoming assholes. If I had to guess why people tend to take your comments to heart its down to them falling into either of the 2 groups I mentioned above. They view your tirades as either a direct attack on them as a person, or they view it as a direct attack on their online asshole and react accordingly. This results in hurt feelings, sore asses and emotional explosions all wrapped up in a text box of impotent post rage. Its not for me to say whether your tactic is right or wrong because I have never encountered any context where applying that mechanism of aggression-as-time-saver would be a realistic option. I do admire the efficiency of it all though and the time you invested in it. Switching topic, this whole 'hubski is kleins and not your thing' is BS. I read a lot of stuff on hubski, I rarely post because honestly I don't have the fucking time :(. Right now hubski is a collection of people who interact on a pretty personal level, I have a sense of each of the more active persons on the site and what their interests are. Compare that to other sites where its a shotgun blast of unknown, unknowable strangers commenting and then disappearing forever into a void... klein is one of the reasons I visit this site but if he left I would still be here. The same can be said for many others regardless of their follower count which matters little IMO.
From my own perspective this is not how I or indeed many others view their "online persona". For some our online personas are simply an extension of our offline personalities, We try to communicate online exactly as we do in real life. For some others they have an even less sophisticated online self which, due to the de-inhibiting nature of anonymity results in them becoming assholes. i recall similar talk from kleinbl00 a while ago. it was in a thread made by a first time poster and it detailed some heavy personal life stuff. klein and others thought of it as a failure because the user starting their "hubski persona" with such a post seemed gauche. i remember finding it really interesting seeing these concepts discussed so starkly. i will try finding the thread but i do not trust my searching capabilities.You have an evolved sense of online self which I would guess is not the case with many of those you interact with.
I think the "vampire invite" may need to be either in a comment or by someone that doesn't have you muted. We definitely haven't intentionally done away with it. Test: kleinbl00
You know, I've never seen any of the twilight films, am I missing out? At this point I sort of wear it as a badge of honor.
You my friend should start watching all the old Mystery Science Theater 3000's on YouTube. Start with Mitchell and play around from there. They're all gold.
Where do I find it straight through and not just snippets? Help, I'm old and stuff.
I've never seen them or read the books. I read this rationalist retelling of the series instead, and thought it was great. So I now have nothing but positive mental associations with Twilight.
That's kind of awesome. I'ma check that out. There was a brief shining period when Breaking Dawn was going to happen but hadn't quite happened where this piece was completely hilarious.
It's long and as strange as you'd guess. Eminently worth it, though. I accidentally got deep into the rationalist fiction community (which means anything from the denser side of Yudkowsky to merely making sure your plots are idiot ball-proof) and am really loving the output. Scions include Ra HPMoR Worm This retelling of Superman (?) and Luminosity. Turns out you don't have suspend disbelief to write/read good fiction!
My favorite is HPMoR, which imo is the most well written. Worm is second best although...substantial. Honestly, I couldn't get into a lot of the other ones because of the "fan fic style" they're written in, it immediately takes me out of the story. Have you read any Neal Stephenson (I'm sure you have)? He has a similar writing style.
I actually watched 2 of them with my sisters. The cinema was in the next jewish town - now that I write this, I wonder if there is a cinema in any major arabic town in israel, whatever - and the bus connections were inconvenient (back then, 3 buses a day), so I HAD to drive my sisters to the cinema. And there was no other movie in parallel blabla... In short, it was either wait outside, drive back home, or watch the movie. So I did. Sitting there as the only guy between teenage girls and soccer moms. It felt weird, but I kinda got into the mood of the movie. You know, when a story sucks you in even though it's dumb and you have popcorn. Until this guy (Edward?) walked into sunlight for the first time. He fucking started to glitter. I totally lost it. Laughed so hard I started coughing up the popcorn I had just eaten. All around me the girls were giving me the deathray vision and loudly calling "shushhhh". I behaved after that, as well as I could. One of the funniest unexpected moments I ever had. Now that I spoiled the surprise, I would not reccomend watching the movie. Totally predictable, except for glittering vampires.
Yeah, that's the way it's always been. You should only be able to reply to the person that invited you in. Edit: but no matter where I go, I can still reply
-that's strange. Even on comments where you were not shouted-out?
Does it? I don't entirely agree. Are there "big players" here? I guess, but only by the virtue that they post a lot, and share a lot, and comment a lot. It's not like I sit around with baited breath waiting for the next post by eightbitsamurai (indeed, I've never read Hubskina. Sorry dude, it's just not my bag), or lil, or TNG, or anyone else. When they do comment, sometimes I like what they have to say, or find it valuable, other times I'm completely disinterested. I see a lot of TNG on my feed. This is for a few reasons: 1.) He's one of the few people I follow. 2.) He posts to #tags I find interesting 3.) He posts A LOT. Occasionally I think it's his job, and the other job he has is just a front where he launders those sweet hubwheels into cold, hard, cash. I jest, of course, with the last one, but perhaps I shouldn't considering the topic at hand, and how it seems like everything gets painted as some sort of internet popularity contest. Most of the people who are "power users" here are people who interact with everyone, a lot of the time. If you did that, then you too, if you chose, could what passes for a "power user" on this website. You'll get double what you're paid now, and people will view your comments as gifts from an omnipotent being. Frankly, the first perk is more likely than the second. Allow me to make a reccomendation to you, my Lojbanic friend (I still wish I had any kind of hand with languages, it would be cool to have conversations in lojban, but alas I've got other focuses in my life). If you don't do it already, instead following people, follow #tags. You're exponentially more likely to find the content that you like, find less of the "clique" (which I've never seen to exist. perhaps i'm part of the "clique"? I've no idea), and find interactions with other people which you will find valuable. And that is the crux of the matter - Finding conversations with other people that you find valuable. I've had some great conversations with camarillobrillo, and BLOB_CASTLE, and nowaypablo (we're both classical musicians), and many others. Some people with bigger "names" than other people, but all fine people. If I want to know about motorcycles, I ask KB, if I want to know about how cities are built, I ask NewlyLostAgain. If I want to know about constructed languages, I would probably ask you. On the rare occasions you step up to the plate, your opinion is on the same playing field as anyone else to me. KB doesn't get a pass on facts any more than you do, nor does TNG or any other "power user".
Hey thenewgreen, you didn't get tagged so I wanted to make sure you saw this comment. Because I liked it.3.) He posts A LOT. Occasionally I think it's his job, and the other job he has is just a front where he launders those sweet hubwheels into cold, hard, cash.
Thanks for the shout out. I appreciated the comment. I'm pretty well over this thread. I had no idea how many followers I had prior to this post, nor do I care. Power users? Powering what? What fucking power do any of us have? I have the power to share my opinion on a website I helped build. Most all of you in this post could claim the same IMO. Is that power? I don't see it that way. I'm not in to internet points, I don't "game," -I interact. I love people. Like a LOT. I'm very much the same person on and off of Hubski. This is just how I roll :) I like cspoons point that we are all held to the same account here. I agree. Edit: I just read nowaypablo's comment in this thread. Right on man. I agree 100%
We gotta have a hubski meetup. Just gotta. I love learning about people. My style at bars alternates between talking for hours and listening to other people talk for hours, both of which I enjoy equally. One of these years...I love people. Like a LOT. I'm very much the same person on and off of Hubski. This is just how I roll :)
The Arctic Monkeys are from Sheffield! When I saw them live, my friend found their tour bus round back and we camped out like the groupies we were, for like 3 hours. There was a group of guys there from Sheffield who had followed AM to NYC on their tour. The brits were intimidatingly handsome and swiftly stole the attention of the girls I was with. I now imagine Sheffield as a little town of Russell Brands writing alternative rock music. Just so you know that's how I picture you now. sidenote: We left before the band came out :(
How does this new image of me compare to your old one? I no longer have the long hair.
humanodon It's gotten to a point here that "power users" is just some sort of Orwellian Doublespeak for "Kleinbl00". So when people say they have a problem with "power users", they really only mean one person, and when they say "Problem", they mean "he hurt my feelings" or "he made his facts not equal to my assertions!" I've never done any serious dancing with KB, but I've never had to because 1.) I like being wrong almost as much as I like being corrected 2.) I value the facts, and how i feel about the situation is secondary 3.) If you read something in a KB comment that differs from what you know, and you look it up, you can usually find a citation for it. If you can't, he'd frankly give it to you. Most of the time what he says is well researched and thought out, so after reading more into the topic, if I didn't agree before, I at the very least see where he's coming from. If you post something, then someone comes and says " You're dumb", then you can get mad all you want. If someone says "You're dumb and here's why" then you need to take a hard look and make sure you're on solid footing. People don't want to take the time to do that, so they get upset and butthurt about the whole thing instead of learning. Idunno about you, but I'm here to learn.
Actually, I don't really contribute much these days,
Yeah, I noticed that. I like to think that it's because you have a lot of kick ass stuff happening in your life right now. Am I right?
Does it?
Yes, it does.
Are there "big players" here?
Yes. And there are tools in place for them to dominate the conversation.
Most of the people who are "power users" here are people who interact with everyone, a lot of the time. If you did that, then you too, if you chose, could what passes for a "power user" on this website.
Don't condescend to me. Every attempt at posting here has been met with a block, a mute, or the use whatever new feature allows board censorship.
If you don't do it already, instead following people, follow #tags.
I follow enough tags on Twitter and Tumblr. This place is little more than a miniature Reddit and in that regard, it fails to bring content I can't find there.
Dude, I'm not being condescending. I'm disagreeing, but not condescending. Condescending would involve significantly more baby noises and cat pictures. ... I don't really understand this. You click a button to follow a person, you click a button to follow a tag. It's physically no different of an action, and vastly improves the user experience ( in my opinion, of course, ymmv). I'm looking through your comment, and your posting history, and I can't see anything where you've been censored, or even anything that looks like an argument. Indeed, you posted one of my favourite posts of all time "How to Make Love to a Trans Person". Unless you've deleted those comments which have been inflammatory to others? Why do you feel censored?I follow enough tags on Twitter and Tumblr.
Every attempt at posting here has been met with a block, a mute, or the use whatever new feature allows board censorship.
That's because I've been muted or hushed so that I can't comment on the posts that interest me.I'm looking through your comment, and your posting history, and I can't see anything where you've been censored, or even anything that looks like an argument.
There is no need for apology, because Hubskina should be nobody's bag, unless that bag happens to be for the garbage. This is the first time I've been on a website where people think I'm a power-user. That's almost offensive because it implies that I don't have better shit to do (no offense, ya'll). Rescuetime tells me I average on about 1 hr 20 min a week on Hubski. It's not like I sit down, swipe my card, and clock in for "Hubski time". I don't even comment all that often. I hit about 10 comments a day at my most active. I share maybe one thing a day, and the only OC I post is a meta-narrative-fanfiction about people I've never met in real life. About once every two weeks. Who watches the watchme-I mean, power-users.
I like it. You can define every website and app on a scale of productiveness, from 'very distracting' to neutral to 'very productive'. It's accurate. I have the premium version and it gives me lots of sexy graphs and whatnot. Really it's most worth it when you have the premium version. The free version is good too, though.
I think the word you're looking for is friends. Hubski has a lot of friends. Cause it's a friendly place. Reddit's power-users have infamy and power. We have history and humor. Nobody is trying to take control of anything here.
With a quick glance at your profile, you've got some interesting shares, and some chill music posted. You seem like a cool person. But I've never seen you, ever, on this website. I would totally include you if I'd ever met you before. We're all chillin' at this bar dude. If you walk in all alone and sit in the corner, I might not notice you to ditch my group and go see if you're a cool person or not. You gotta come up and drink with us, not blame us for spending time with each other and not you. It's middle school, it's high school, it's college, it's the office, it's the party, it's Hubski, it's life. Nothing new here, except the fact that you can literally find a common interest with someone at this table, no matter what. It couldn't be easier. Start your own conversation, and speak up.
I've tried starting a narrative project that seemed to interest only me; it was my failed #45thworldproblems.
I have maybe 12 tags I've only posted once to that were ignored. 8bit has like 25 chapters of a story he's worked on for nearly half a year, and maybe 5 people read it religiously. Try again, with respect, just quit being a baby :D
I dunno, you started off very cryptically. This is the most conversation I've seen out of you. #45thworldproblems was interesting, but after repeated attempts to engage (from my recollection anyway) and getting little interaction, it's pretty obvious why interest ebbed. This site is all about interaction. If you don't play, no one will play back.
That project annoyed the shit out of me and I found it pretentious as all hell. I mean, maybe you find my poetry jazz pretentious as all hell so we're even, but if you wanna know why people were turned off, maybe I wasn't the only one who felt that way. Maybe the problem is that you were driving for recognition in the first place. In addition, as I recall, at least one of your posts blew up and was badged, and people began to explore other posts under your tag as a result. In general I noticed your posts ticking up my feed for some time. I'll admit their popularity seemed relatively short-lived but you could have also worked to prevent or mitigate that, I guess. Personally, I thought you were posting too prolifically, too enigmatically, and too ostentatiously, but don't take my advice on it - for some reason, even though about two people read my blog unless it's a really, really good post, that doesn't stop me from putting it up there anyway. You should post things because you want to share them (or, for AskHubski, get feedback/opinion/whatever). You shouldn't post for attention.