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A friend of mine sent this to me. Would especially like to hear from those of you who are parents.
There are points with which I agree 100 percent, and some that are sort of anachronistic. In my opinion, the correct way to go about children and cell phones is to buy them a nonsmart phone when they become old enough to need to call you for rides from places, etc., and then to later upgrade them to a smartphone with actual functionality if you think they're worthy of it. (This should happen at the age of 17 or later.)
Parents are too afraid to let their kids fuck up. I see helicopter parents like this all the time, and I think it has a profoundly negative effect on the kids. Of my friends from high school, the ones with overbearing parents just went crazy after high school. They ended up dropping out of college or having some sort of significant existential crisis, as they didn't really know how to deal with life in an independent manner. The best way to learn is to make mistakes. There's also no better time to make mistakes than when you're a kid, because you just don't have that many responsibilities...and the only real ramification is that you might get a stern talking to from your parents or get grounded. But instead parents are focuses on preventing any mistakes in the first place, which stifles any growing up that is supposed to happen.
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flagamuffin · 2086 days ago · link ·
Yeah, I see where you're coming from (and it's true that the kids who go crazy in high school get it together for college -- I know; I'm one of them). But it's important to remember that we're dealing with a 13-year-old kid who probably doesn't need a phone anyway, and also that it's a goddamn privilege. You can make the argument that having them sign a contract is just being pragmatic and imparting a life lesson of another sort: when you live independently, you damn well better be ready to honor contracts to landlords, bursars, the telephone company and everything in between.
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I would argue that a 13 year old is old enough to know right from wrong. And you're right he probably doesn't need a phone, much less an iPhone, so either 1) Don't give him such a privilege or 2) Trust his judgement. Meddling about and choosing something between 1 and 2 is not healthy.
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flagamuffin · 2085 days ago · link ·
Yeah, I think the middle ground between 1 and 2 is getting a nonsmart phone that serves the purpose of keeping track of him but isn't such a large distraction.
StephenBuckley · 2086 days ago · link ·
Non-parent: Kinda concerned that this doesn't have anything in it for the kid. I didn't get a cell phone till 18, so maybe I'm mistaken in this, but I think as a kid I would like a clause like "If I don't have a reason to look through your phone, I won't, and if I do, I will tell you that I am doing it. I will not give you 'warning,' and you will not be given the phone before I look at it."
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flagamuffin · 2086 days ago · link ·
The phone. (Devil's advocate argument. Is that enough in and of itself?)Non-parent: Kinda concerned that this doesn't have anything in it for the kid.
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ButterflyEffect · 2086 days ago · link ·
There should be some privacy involved. I can see where the parent is coming from, but growing up, many of friends who became "rebellious" were the ones with overbearing parents. Privacy would allow him to go out, make some mistakes sure, but hopefully learn from them. That in and of itself is more valuable than the phone, and the rules with nothing in it for the kid doesn't seem realistic. Yes, there's the phone, but that's then contradicted by her saying that she paid for it, it's hers and she's loaning it to him.
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flagamuffin · 2086 days ago · link ·
a) kid's 13. Let's not forget that. No 13-year-old should have a cell phone, in my opinion, but that's separate. b) he's not paying for it. It's pretty cut and dry to me; if the kid pays for his cell phone, the parents lose all ability to regulate how he uses it. If the parents pay for his cell phone, the kid loses all ability to regulate how he uses it. (I agree about the rebellious kid point, but put that aside as a reason for a moment.)
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StephenBuckley · 2086 days ago · link ·
That's a very capitalist way of looking at it, and if the kid has that understanding of the right to privacy, that's fine. Personally, I think that if someone thinks that something should be private and I don't have pressing and/or reasonable evidence that it should not be, then no matter who owns the medium, they should get some modicum of privacy. Granted, there's a lotta wiggle room in that sentence! And I would just like to emphasize that I'm a Non-parent. So obviously I'd argue the kid's side. It's the only side I've been on!
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I've always found it abhorrent that children don't have any assumed right to privacy. Having a private life is kind of necessary to maintain your sanity. But adults are always the ones who make the rules, and so long as they don't have any kind of respect for minors the situation stays the same. No one chooses to be a child. Parents, however, often choose to be parents, but then they have the assumed right of dictating the life of their child. For those who have good parents, its not an issue. For those who don't, its like being born into prison for 18 years. Think on this: A child is the only person whom you can legally hit maliciously.
flagamuffin · 2086 days ago · link ·
I'm also a non-parent, thank god. But I would jump to the parents' side here (except the dumb blogging about it part...) because I've dealt with a lot of irresponsible kids. I think the lesson the kid will take from it is get a job as soon as physically possible (14 in the States, or earlier with hardship proof, I think) and escape the shackles he's been placed under. This makes sense to me, and I think it's a great way to parent. In her place, I probably wouldn't have written a contract; I would have discussed this with my kid and then trusted him to follow through. Getting his signature was a needlessly dramatic move.and if the kid has that understanding of the right to privacy, that's fine.
If he doesn't he'll learn it from this, yeah? Most kids learn about privacy most directly through internet and cell phone use these days, I think.
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StephenBuckley · 2086 days ago · link ·
Yeah, the publicity is definitely a strange thing, but I suppose it's increasingly common in the digital age to post whatever comes to mind, and she clearly spent a while thinking about this.
GodOfAtheism · 2086 days ago · link ·
I feel bad for the lad. Sounds like his mother is riding him something hard. Top that off with this getting media coverage and I feel really bad for his social life, because we all know how kids are at 13 or so. Being the kid whos mom made a contract for him to have a cell phone? Ouch.
I liked this one. Some of them were a little bit harsh (and could actually lead to less social ability rather than more), but overall I understand the message the mother was trying to get across.13. Don't take a zillion pictures and videos. There is no need to document everything. Live your experiences. They will be stored in your memory for eternity.
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ButterflyEffect · 2086 days ago · link ·
I too, enjoyed this one. I find this happens a lot of concerts, and it's different from person to person, but I don't get enjoyment in taking a lot of pictures of the band playing just so I can post them to Facebook. It's a more wholesome experience to not be distracted by that and just take in the moment that's happening in front of you. I feel like this applies to many different aspects of life, even if it's just enjoying a night with your friends. Some pictures are fine, but not if it detracts from the experience.
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ButterflyEffect · 2086 days ago · link ·
I've been to many a concert where there have been people doing nothing but taking pictures, same with some dinners, taking an absurd amount of pictures when you're just hanging out with friends. It's unnecessary and clutter, I'm the same way as you are on this one.
littlebirdie · 2086 days ago · link ·
What bothers me most about this piece is that her son's friends now all know about it and certainly must be giving him the what for, you know? I have written quite a bit about my boys, but I am sure to never, ever chastise them in the public arena - even in ways that come across as loving, like this which I suppose is a pre-chastisement. I only tell the funny and beautiful things. If I posted this, my boy would fling the phone across the room and hide under his bed for a month. Now, putting that aside, much of the advice is okay, although I would never have come up with such a list for my kids. I trust them 100 percent, and although they make mistakes like we all do, they trust me enough to talk to me when they make a mistake. I'm sure they do and say and think things that they will never tell me, but that's part of growing up, too.