Holy shit, DoJ s̶e̶i̶z̶e̶d̶ borrowed Trump's passports!!
B̶u̶c̶k̶l̶e̶ ̶u̶p̶.̶ ̶T̶h̶e̶y̶'̶r̶e̶ ̶g̶o̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶i̶n̶d̶i̶c̶t̶.̶ sigh
And to all the stupid pundits asking why the passports weren't included on the list of documents in the search warrant: U.S. citizens do not own their passports, the feds do, and the gov't can suspend or cancel passports at any time. I just read it. Page 5. Thus, they seemingly don't need to include passports in a search warrant.
Bear in mind that only Trump has made this claim, at the time of my comment, but I can't figure out why he'd be lying about this one. edit: to push the narrative of "MOST PERSECUTED, BUT BEST BOY EVER IN THE UNIVERSE", am_U, you fucking idiot.
Yeah no, it's perfectly clear, and Forbes is just shitty at journalism, at least in this arena of subject matter. One was an expired, regular citizen passport, one is a valid, regular citizen passport, and the last is a green "diplomatic" passport issued when he was POTUS to facilitate POTUS travels.
Also, just to gloat, and reassure myself that the system might yet hold:
I'm still blowing this thread up because this truly is a momentous thing to watch unfold. The way Trump and his defenders are reacting has me both very afraid and howling in laughter.
Trump's now asking for some of the seized material to be returned, citing attorney client privilege:
- Sources familiar with the investigation told Fox News Saturday that the former president’s team was informed that boxes labeled A-14, A-26, A-43, A-13, A-33, and a set of documents—all seen on the final page of the FBI’s property receipt —contained information covered by attorney-client privilege.
Yeah, I checked the warrant, and UPDATE: Nvm, I had confused one of those, A-13, with 13A. The attorney-client privilege claims may not involve top secret info like I had initially thought.
I bet he announces his candidacy this week. He intends to use it as a shield against prosecution(s), and I think his time may almost be up. This is a very cut-and-dry case. Intent matters not. If you "accidentally" took nuclear secrets home with you, you're just as guilty as if you did it on purpose. If they indict him, I think more than one or two FBI field offices are gonna have some problems. DeSantis is also doing his best to aid in domestic terrorism, of course.
Speaking of which, there is almost certainly an investigation already underway into who leaked those FBI agents' names to Breitbart. Am I supposed to believe Trump wasn't involved in that? He had the only other unredacted copy of the warrant. The desperation is palpable.
edit: some of these takes are just hilarious. Fox’s Doocy: ‘It would be great’ if Trump called for end to threats against feds. LOLOL.
- “Whatever we can do to help — because the temperature has to be brought down in the country,” he added. “If it isn’t, terrible things are going to happen.”
How the hell is there any way to interpret that except as a threat??? He'll never outright condemn violence and threats against the FBI, Doocey, you dumbass, it's one of his last remaining bargaining chips.
edit2: Apparently, after the above quote about wanting to help lower the temperature, Trump went on to make additional lies-based attacks on the FBI. Classic!
DeSantis is plotting to use this against him as early as is convenient, which may not be until January or whenever he officially announces his bid. Your opponent hands you the remote to his suicide belt, you definitely click the button...but not until you're at a safe distance.
As for the "leak", as far as I can tell, there's nothing illegal about making a search warrant public. It's only confidential from the government's side (at least as far as I read in the news the other day). So while that was certainly in bad judgement, I'm not sure good judgement has ever been part of his calculus.
I know, DeSantis is just towing the party line, for now; fomenting violence. Terrifying.
Honestly, this last week has me questioning whether or not it's possible to ever divorce Trump from his base this side of the grave. Ron really has his work cut out for him.
- nothing illegal about making a search warrant public.
Ehhhh I think we could be flirting with incitement charges (am_U says to himself, for the billionth time). I dunno if the charges would stick, but it's obvious what the intention is when the names are published after the field office (/cornfield) incident and Garland's warning about escalating threats against the FBI. And Breitbart being the only source willing to publish the names.
So, VIOLENCE 1 was "I'ma take my nail gun to shoot up the FBI because bulletproof glass isn't nailproof, oops, yes it is, let me post on social media and then kill myself." VIOLENCE 2 was "I'm going to drive through this crash barrier, oops, no I'm not, I'm gonna shoot in the air a few times and then kill myself."
I don't care what else is said about Trumpians and MAGAheads. Fundamentally? They are FOLLOWERS. They are not LEADERS. Given their 'druthers they will FOLLOW the President of the United States to hell and back and fuck anyone who gets in their way - assuming it's a president they like. They'll follow Richard Spencer, they'll follow Enrique Tarrio, they'll follow Tucker Carlson.
This requires a leader in front of them. Absent leadership, they are clowns. Anyone with any inkling of self-motivation or leadership? Does not follow a populist. The Bundys didn't seize Malheur for anyone but themselves. Tulsi Gabbard? She's marching to her own drum. There's a reason we haven't heard from Ann Coulter or Paul Ryan or Jason Chaffetz in years - they thrive in a multihierarchal Taliban, not a monarchy.
Guaranteed - anybody who survived four years of Trump in the Republican Party has learned that "the base" will follow any demagogue who says the right things. "The base" may not think this, but if they thought much they wouldn't be the base. What we're watching now is sharks smelling blood in the water but not enough to make them strike.
The Republicans are not going to run Trump. Trump? Trump is definitely going to run Trump. And that is going to be delicious.
- "I'ma take my nail gun to shoot up the FBI because bulletproof glass isn't nailproof, oops, yes it is, let me post on social media and then kill myself."
This kind of loopy thinking always makes me suspicious that there are government agents behind it, who have radicalized some simp, and gotten them to take action they (probably) would never have chosen themselves.
Who SERIOUSLY thinks bulletproof glass can be defeated by a nailgun? That's just dumb as shit, and seems exactly like the kind of dumb ideas FBI agents feed their sources to make the sources do something patently illegal.
I do wonder how much of the FBI is dedicated to setting up dopes and then toppling them ... and laughing when the poor putz is laying on the ground full of holes...
That's literally the most enduring talking point and legal-defense-but-not-really made by the J6 rioters and Trump.
FBI incitement definitely happens, but an increasing number of Trumpists are farrrrrrr past needing any nudges from law enforcement to go full-on kamikaze. And the FBI probably isn't trying to incite many people to attack... the FBI.
If only 0.01% of all Trump 2020 voters are willing to commit violence to aid Emperor Godking (I think the true percentage is prolly quite a bit higher), that's 7,000 terrorists. Granted, they're much too stupid to organize well, on their own, but that's what T̶w̶i̶t̶t̶e̶r̶ TRUTH Social is for.
We have zero confusion about "willing to commit violence." You continue to assume "able to commit USEFUL violence" is a given.
We have seen the sum total of Team Trump's organizational prowess. They had all three branches of government, they had social media, they had support from Russia, they had tear gas on the streets, they had disavowed border patrol squads in rented vans cruising Portland to arrest people, they had an entire political party announcing their platform was "whatever Trump says." All that? some shit smeared on the walls, a bunch of congresscritters (justifiably) cowering in their offices and the whole of government waiting for them to get bored and go home.
What's the pathway to power from here? They will never again get as far as January 6th, and January 6th was miles and miles and miles away from a successful coup.
We got dumb shits walking into Walmart with three ARs because they hate Mexicans. I'm not about to say the MAGAts lack a limitless capacity for violence. But it doesn't do anything. Imagine how much more effective two idiots with nailguns would have been? Holy shit - what if there were three of them! But the Gretchen Whitmer conspiracy, which may or may not have been goaded on by the FBI, didn't even make it to a credible threat against the governor of Wisconsin.
"If anyone wants to do it, no amount of protection is enough. All a man needs is a willingness to trade his life for mine."
- John F. Kennedy
Things have gotten a bit more Hard Mode since Lee Harvey Oswald. Still, "lone crazy" is the way to go: "lone crazy" got John Kennedy, "lone crazy" got Bobby Kennedy, "lone crazy" almost got Reagan, "a bunch of people talking" gets you "maybe they were gonna try and knock off John Bolton eventually."
The fucking Proud Boys invited a documentary crew along
And I mean, they were hardly the first. I'll go ahead and posit a maxim: the more attention your organization attracts, the less you will accomplish in the future.
So. All the right needs is a charismatic, secretive, competent and dedicated organization capable of thwarting a forewarned Deep State whose sole purpose is to restore Donald Trump to power for some reason.
What are the odds of that, do you think?
The pattern is "hey buddy wanna do a crime?" followed by "Hey I happen to have all the resources you might possibly want in order to do a crime" accompanied by "might I suggest a target for this crime." This pattern usually starts with "those brown dudes over there are suspect". The classic example is the Liberty City Seven.
If it's the FBI, though, the criming is clear-cut: "Hey, Randy - here's a shotgun, can you saw it off in violation of the NFA for me real quick? I'll give you $40." That's where the Liberty City Seven fell apart: "Hey, my name is Al Kayda and I would like to pay you fifty grand to blow up the Sears Tower. Also here's a bunch of guns and explosives." "Nice to meet you, Al, we're good on explosives and guns but we'd very much like your $50k."
If the FBI is behind it, they don't fuck around with unclear shit. What would be the point? "Nail guns go through bulletproof glass, therefore intent will be really simple to establish in a court of law."
LOL I maintain that anyone who doubts the authenticity of stupid internet commenters need only sell one (1) object on Craigslist.
The reasons airports have smelled like feet since 2002.
I was at the supermall some years back. Every kiosk had an official warning about counterfeit currency - someone was cutting the 20s off $20 bills and gluing them onto $1s. This had previously made the news as "the absolute worst counterfeiting attempt in the history of money" or some shit so I asked the first cashier I saw with one if it was a joke.
"We don't joke about money," she said. Six cashiers after that said something similar.
Randy Weaver was radicalized when an FBI agent asked him to cut the barrel off a shotgun. Weaver said, "Sure, I can do that." "Even though it's illegal," the undercover agent said. "Who cares if it's illegal," Weaver said, and started cutting with a hacksaw. The agent watched, waited, and said "and now I have to arrest you."
- Who SERIOUSLY thinks bulletproof glass can be defeated by a nailgun?
The same people who think the election was stolen? That the COVID vaccine has microchips in it? That the earth is flat? That the sky is full of chemtrails? That 5G is mind control rays? That the Bilderberg Group runs the world? That Q is JFK Jr?
That was rhetorical, right?
- Tulsi Gabbard? She's marching to her own drum.
Well, the human mealworm is out there, I saw him on Fox a week or two ago. His delivery sucks. The others, I will grant you agreement, but not Tulsi, who is currently covering for Tucker Carlson's primetime slot. I guess if "the beat of her own drum" constitutes pretending to be a leftist for a few years while parroting right wing extremist talking points, sure. Her delivery is even worse. It makes you realize how much Tucker routinely gets away with saying, just because of how he says it.
- Trump is definitely going to run Trump.
100% agree on that, I just don't see the party managing to shake him. Even when he lies so poorly that by the time his sycophants in congress repeat his most recent lie, he's already contradicted them with a brand new one. Meh, it doesn't matter too much who leads the fascists, because we are still woefully far from confronting the underlying issues driving this faux-populist bullshit.
Check this out though. Batshit. It's a level of absurdity so high that I'm pretty sure you could convince even the most hardcore Tucker fans that it's grade-AA whackadoodle. It might take a whole four minutes to debunk those two minutes of content. It's crazy how radical political rhetoric is allowed to get if it's completely insulated from criticisms. The best is how it ends, like, the viewer is supposed to think "No, the threat of violence is NOT from the extremists. It's from republicans, like me!"
Tulsi Gabbard and Andrew Yang are craven opportunists. They'll do whatever gets them further. Joe Lieberman was the same way.
And that's the important thing to realize: the whole of the Trump coterie are craven opportunists. Some of them calculated sooner than others that the opportunities had dried up. You're talking about a political party with zero institutional memory and loyalty only when it matters: how much is it going to cost every Republican auditor in the country to go "yeah you know what actually Trump did lose the election" as soon as he becomes sufficiently toxic?
You're missing the point with Tulsi Gabbard. It's not about what can be debunked. It's about enjoying the same media experience.
Hahahahahha, thanks, I love every Seagal-Russia installation. Aikido is hilarious, too. The fact that he's allowed to do what he does and not lose his citizenship or face legal recourse (vs. any Russian celebrity coming over here to spout anti-Kremlin propaganda) tells you everything you need to know about which country is actually fascist.
- zero institutional memory
Case in point: Tulsi endorsed Biden after dropping out of her 2020 POTUS primary running. Two years later, sleepy Joe is a terrifying dictator. Comedy gold.
- how much is it going to cost every Republican auditor in the country to go "yeah you know what actually Trump did lose the election" as soon as he becomes sufficiently toxic?
I know I'm supposed to say "nothing", but for some, their lives could be threatened. Even after GOP leadership attempts to dump him. And it scares me that more GOP leadership isn't using this FBI search and seizure to do exactly that. edit: Well damn, maybe some are trying after all?
I guess this is where I plead age: The BATF, which had gotten in the habit of excessive force against extremists, used excessive force against extremists and killed a mom and son with sniper fire. A year (TO THE DAY!) later, the BATF used excessive force and caused a whole bunch of people to get killed by sniper fire ( same sniper BTW). This caused reprisals and, on the part of the BATF, introspection.
This may be controversial for me to say, but if you were a right-leaning patriot with a casual disrespect of government authority, the police state was out to get you in the '90s. There were legitimate criticisms of the way the BATF, DOJ and FBI, under the direction of the Democratic Clinton administration, approached policing of right-wing extremism. This caused over-reaction by the right wing and by the Clinton administration, whereby the Clinton administration started pussy-footing around Nazis and the right wing splintered into the Tim McVeigh wing
and the Alex Jones wing.
9:26 for the lazy; both clips were filmed at Waco in the same week, not sure about the same day.
The Tim McVeigh wing was at "do something" and something they did, expecting it to ignite a civil war as the Turner Diaries have long assured them it would. It did not and they were largely disillusioned. The Montana Freemen, the Bundys, every separatist movement on the Right went "well, I guess it's us, best keep our heads down 'cuz the cavalry ain't comin'." The Alex Jones wing was at "shout about it" and shout they did, acknowledging that the inability of the Tim McVeigh wing to accomplish anything meant they had a bulletproof grift until the end of time, the ability to bark at pedestrians from the safety of the couch because mommy was never going to open the screen door and force an interaction with the evil monster on the sidewalk. I find it extremely ironic that Tim McVeigh sold bumper stickers, determined it wasn't doing anything, and proceeded to murder nineteen children, 40 HUD employees, 35 SSA employees, eleven DOT employees, 5 DEA agents and assorted other innocent bystanders who were in no way anywhere on Janet Reno's org chart. I find it unironic as hell that afterwards, Alex Jones proceeded to build a career around secret cabals.
From my perspective? Crazy rednecks STOPPED taking up arms after Oklahoma City.
April 19, 1992: Ruby Ridge
April 19, 1993: Waco
April 19, 1995: Oklahoma City
'96 and '97 were calm, '98 was Kip Kinkel, '99 was Columbine and from that point forth, the violence was crazy angry teenaged boys. And see, that's just it - fuckin' militias were a real thing growing up. Organized adult males hell-bent on crime and white supremacy? it was just the water we swam in. The fuckin' Proud Boys are a bunch of cosplayers compared to The Order and considering how toothy forensics has gotten in the age of DNA, social media and smart phones, shit ain't never goin' back.
So yeah. "their lives could be threatened." But we've seen what the average deathwish MAGA is capable of.
If you want a taste of what White Privilege violence really looks like, I have a book recommendation.
Wow, that is quite some Northwest history right there...
Do you all think this is more of an Arrested Development or Schitts Creek scenario?
It's always been Arrested Development. Except all of the children are Gob.
As far as "today," there were rumors this morning that trump was going to have a bad day, but I didn't see anything specific. As far as "eventually" it's been pretty clear since the archivist reported receiving shreds that sumpin was gonna happen.
I think the hoi polloi are confusing "meticulous caution" with "cowardice." If no ex-president has ever been charged with a felony before, the first time you do it there will be all sorts of precedent set.
History may not repeat itself but it sure does rhyme, doesn’t it? Watergate - don’t fuck with the records (tapes).
Whatever you want to call this - don’t fuck with the records (documents).
See, Watergate was one thing - in order to win an election, members of one political party committed a crime against members of another party. It never expanded beyond that - "did the President of the United States order/consent to a break-in at the Democratic National Committee." "What did the President know and when did he know it?" Compare and contrast:
I don't think the records raid is part of some grand strategy. I think the records raid is "I mean yeah we know the dude has classified information in a location foreign nationals have ready access to at any time of the day or night in direct contravention of clear and established law so despite the fact that this is gonna be the most grievous action ever taken against a former president, WE HAVE TO."
I personally am loving that the Jan 6 committee now has Alex Jones' texts, and that this supposedly upsets Tucker Carlson a great deal. The vibe I'm getting is that the country is starting to wake up, hung over, pukey, going "well shit I guess I gotta clean this place up."
I had to watch some Fox News last night. MFers were apoplectic. They had no arguments, they had no rational objections, but they had a lot to say about Hunter Biden and the "praetorian guard" for some reason. Stephen Miller, Steve Bannon, even Matthew Fucking Whitaker. I let an hour of angry white men acting like you'd walked in on them while they were taking a shit and then you refused to leave. I get that the Right is s00000000000per mad right now? But they sure as shit aren't coherent about it.
Love that they did it last night, when they knew he'd be in New York to give a deposition.
I dunno about a grand strategy, but I don't think they'd take this step unless there's an overwhelming likelihood that he'll be indicted. Not even necessarily as a result of the raid, or indicted on charges related to classified documents, but just in regards to the relationship of trust with the public the DoJ is trying to maintain.
Yeah I was watchin' some Fox this morning too, hah. Awesome stuff. I wouldn't say I had "FBI raids Mar-a-Lago" on my bingo card, but I have thought for a couple months or so that DoJ will indeed move on Trump. I heard Buck Sexton on Jesse Watters's show (Jesse is on his own tier of stupid, btw) use the phrase "cross the Rubicon", which is a code phrase for "gonna need to use the guns" on Telegram, Parler, and TRUTH, which I've been browsing this morning. It's terrifying. I knew that Trump et al. would use any prosecution against him to rile up his base, but it's still always jarring to witness real-time.
The idea that the FBI or Garland wanted to do this instead of go through negotiations or a subpoena is pretty funny. Remember how NARA already confiscated records from Mar-A-Lago like a year ago? I'm sure they tried every other avenue. And so far, Garland isn't exactly a firebrand, either, at least in his public statements and posturing. Until now, at least, because this is a yuge statement.
I'm bumping up my timeline, I predict he'll be indicted by the end of the year, just after the midterms. He'll announce his candidacy in a month or two, much to McConnell's frustration, which is one more reason to do it, of course. Still don't think he'll ever go to prison. White House instead.
This is also my bet:
edit: lol the Trump campaign sent out fundraising emails last night, almost immediately after the news broke. Surprise. Also, random, but I've been almost impressed with the top-level embrace of "Dark Brandon".
Yeah the MAGAsphere is just crying out for someone to coordinate some sort of chestpuffery. They got nuthin' tho. Even your buddy there just wants daddy to punish his enemies. "Things will be different when I'm in charge" is wishful thinking, not strategy, and I haven't seen strategy from anyone. Dumbass armed rednecks on their own? that's y'allQaeda shit. It's tedious and dangerous but a threat to the republic it ain't. Threat's over. The only person who can steer this train is Trump and Trump had his conductor card taken away.
And I agree. Garland wouldn't have rolled if he didn't 100% have the goods.
What's going to happen is he's going to be guilty of destroying presidential records, it'll take forever to litigate, the Republican Party won't let him run because secretaries of state can't certify a primary in which the winning contestant can't legally run, and he'll sling mud from the sidelines against everyone who dares to oppose his vision of the Republican Party. It's gonna be hilarious.
The lawyer that got ahold of Alex Jones texts has now read through them all, and he says that it fills him with a feeling of overwhelming sadness and pity.
He EXPECTED to see Alex Jones as the hub or nexus of a grand group of plotters and right wing movers and shakers.
What he found was a profoundly lonely guy, ostracized by everyone he idolizes, and grasping desperately at the edge for any shred of recognition from those he admires.
And Alex Jones also sent erotic photos of his wife to ... Roger Stone.
Just .... eeew.
It's gonna be a fun next few years :D
“A White House official said it was not notified about the search.”
🤔
Link brokey, here's a good one.
Rand Paul is an idiot, yes, but it's long since gotten to the point that you've gotta wonder if he's consciously working against the interests of the American people, financed by foreign adversaries.
The idea that Donald Trump's handling of classified information is a case for repealing the Espionage Act is literally the exact opposite conclusion that any reasonable person would reach. Obviously, this is simply about catering to Trump and his base, and the Trumpists might as well be competing to craft the most ludicrous legal defense theory. "Abolish any laws that Trump has broken" ranks pretty high, I gotta say.
Most "libertarians" in the US are unprincipled reactionaries propping up a fascist leader. So, you know, diametrically opposed to most libertarian principles. If you're indistinguishable from a fascist, I don't really care what you call yourself, I'll call you a fascist. And an inability to discern and condemn fascism bodes very poorly for my assessments of your stated ideals and ideas.
And it's always rich to hear people freely denouncing the government and then complain that they somehow aren't free to denounce the government. Yes, you should absolutely be free to dissent against the State, and in the USA, you are. Past overreaches using the Espionage Act were largely corrected.
That fff.org article is an amazing read, btw. For the life of me, I can't figure out how the author gets from "I think there is prosecutorial overreach in the Assange case" to "there should be no mechanism of enforcing punishments for sharing state secrets". The only stated (il)logic is that "WW1 was bad, and the Espionage Act is related to that." Maybe the best explanation is that the author doesn't believe the state should exist at all? That's so weird, because Russia thinks the same thing about our country! When fully gamed out, the libertarian fantasy always requires a global agreement to simultaneously dissolve or at least greatly diminish every government and military in the world, and to then not attack each other. Libertarianism, the anti-globalist philosophy. The entire school of thought is bankrupt of consistency and utility. Mostly, it's a fancy multi-syllabic word to hide behind because you're tired of people recoiling when you tell them you're a republican.
Rand Paul is a Fellow Traveller. People forget: Ayn Rand invented Objectivism as a reaction to the collectivism of the Bolsheviks. Her whole schtick was "nobody gets to take your stuff away" which makes the most sense for people with stuff. Early objectivists were understandably negative towards the Soviets but modern-day ones just see oligarchs and Objectivism, fundamentally, celebrates oligarchy.
The KGB/FSB did better with Republicans from Goldwater on because game recognizes game. Teddy Roosevelt Republicanism was about the power of the free market while Goldwater-on was about power within the free market - Bork's whole schtick was that monopolies are good unless the government has them in which case individuals are denied their opportunity to get rich.
You'd have a lot more tranquility if you spent more time looking at what they do than at what they say because the political ideology of the Right does not require anyone to speak the truth, to speak candidly, or to experience any ramifications from their speech whatsoever.
- Shortly before Mr. Garland made the announcement, a person close to Mr. Trump reached out to a Justice Department official to pass along a message from the former president to the attorney general. Mr. Trump wanted Mr. Garland to know that he had been checking in with people around the country and found them to be enraged by the search.
The message Mr. Trump wanted conveyed, according to a person familiar with the exchange, was: “The country is on fire. What can I do to reduce the heat?”
Hahhahaha, sure, sure. Trump is notorious for wanting to de-escalate social tension. Just like there is no proof that Trump intentionally uses violence for political gain. Sure, sure.