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thenewgreen

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hubskier for: 3910 days

Founder The New Green

Co-founder Hubski

Co-founder Forever Labs

recent comments, posts, and shares:
thenewgreen  ·  2 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

Well written, as always. I’m genuinely curious to know if you watched the special? I saw someone using humor to show compassion and to simultaneously state what bothers him about the “movement.” I don’t agree with all of it. But on balance, I believe he may have done more brt positive FOR the movement than negative. It ends with a genuine plea for empathy. I’m gonna watch it again tonight with all of these discussions in mind.

I’ve never seen Tootsie.

thenewgreen  ·  2 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

    I'm one of those people who only saw one side which was a clip and a couple of tweets (the team-terf one and one of him laughing because he's becoming even richer from the drama). I'm exclusively going to base my reaction here off of that:
No offense, but this is the problem. He never laughs about how he’s making money off of the drama in the special. Not that I recall. Context matters. It would be like hearing a measure of one song and declaring that the entire album must suck. Watch it. Then come back and discuss.
thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

You know what would be really interesting? If we could watch the special together. Honestly. I’m going to rewatch it and try to do so with what you’ve written above in mind.

Goodnight

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

    same joke, told funnier, on a crunchy ass ifunny meme from 2019 that's a repost off of twitter
It's not the same joke. Dave's joke is much funnier. But that's the thing, this is all very subjective. Humor is subjective. Again, I think it's his least funny special. But its still much funnier than most imo.

I have to get to bed now. I appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts on this. Truly. Onward!

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

Thank you for the description. You're right, describing it helps me to understand it, but totally kills any humor. That joke may be funny for a very small subset of an audience and would tank in a general audience.

For years people have made jokes about so many types of people. And so long as it wasn't in hatred, if it's actually funny it works. I think to a general audience, many of the jokes in this special are funny. Some aren't. But the ones I don't find funny, someone else may. That's the thing. It's comedy. Why is it being taken so seriously? I can't speak for others, but I have watched all his specials and I have not been swayed negatively about transgender people. I have mad respect for what transgender people have to go through to realize their true self manifest. His specials have made me consider that some in the transgender community take his jokes too seriously. But I have never had the sense that he's trying to get me to not respect transgender people or their struggle.

As for picketing Netflix employees etc. HELL YES! that is 100% their prerogative and legal right. And I would fight vigorously to defend it. But I'd be the guy saying, "Hey Q, they were jokes."

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

The question as to whether or not a joke is funny matters. It actually matters quite a lot. Comedians are asked all the time about "where the line is?" What is and isn't off limits in comedy. If someone makes a joke about race, gender and even rape, it had better be at the least funny and at best thought provoking. I think intent is also extremely important. If someone's intent is to genuinely cause harm to a person or a group, it's pretty hard to laugh at.

I have enjoyed Chappelles humor for many years. I have watched his talent grow, significantly. I do not think this special was his best work. Actually, as far as his specials go it was the least funny to me. But it's still very funny and very thought provoking at times. The "Beyond Pussy," joke is actually a pretty clever bit. That one actually made me laugh. Maybe because I have many vegan/vegetarian friends and have had conversations about whether or not the impossible burger genuinely tastes like meat. The idea of asking if a post-op vagina actually tastes like a cis vagina is clever and funny. Something I had never thought of and most people wouldn't say. -How is that transphobic? But there were jokes in there that didn't seem funny or thought provoking to me. The idea that trans women are to cis women as blackface is to African Americans wasn't funny to me, but it does provoke thought. But throughout it all, I never got the sense that he was trying to disparage transgender people at all, at least not about them being transgender. I think he clearly has a hard time with the sensitivity he sees from the community in response to his jokes. A sensitivity and collective reaction that he doesn't see in the AA community. A sensitivity that wasn't allowed for in the AA community and I think to his thinking, still isn't.

    if i, a paleface honky tranny, were to get up on stage talking about how i'm on team blue lives matter and that black people should just settle down, it wouldn't matter if i namedropped a black friend and voted for obama or whatever, people would recognize that it's not funny
Well... if it WAS funny I think you would find a lot of black people might actually laugh. If it was thought provoking, black, white etc may laugh. But, do you think that African American employees of Netflix would boycott and picket if Bill Burr did a special and a large theme of it was about how black people need to settle down? I actually don't think they would, especially if it was funny. Chapelle seems to be saying, "get a sense of humor and stop taking jokes so seriously."

    this despite using the suicide of a trans comedian as a shield for his lame-ass bits
The story of Daphne is sad and I would guess very indicative of many transgender people. PTSD from childhood. When listening to that NPR show I referenced, the one thing that stood out to me was how the woman being interviewed said Dave "used" Daphne. She suggested that they weren't even close. Daphne's sister has since said that Dave was a good friend to her and corroborated his story. I found his description of her bombing and then winning over the crowd by heckling him very touching and very funny.

In most comedy there's someone that is the butt of the joke. It has often been jews, blacks, Mexicans, Italians, women, gays and in this special transgender. But what I find interesting is that most of the material focused not on gender etc, but on sensitivity and cover from the community. The example he gives is that a rapper shot someone in a Walmart and didn't go to prison but Kevin Hart made some homophobic jokes back in 2010 and was cancelled. Literally. He was set to host the Oscars and was dropped. Maybe it was deserved, I didn't read the tweets. But it is my opinion that comedy should be allowed to speak for itself. If it's funny, it will live. If it isn't, it will die. There's no hiding. It's a person and microphone. The audience reacts or they don't.

To boycott Neflix for airing a comedy special is fucked up. imo. If every minority group boycotted standup comedy that made fun of their tribe, there'd be very little standup. And that would be a bad thing. Standup has always pushed the boundaries in society. And it could be in 5-10 years Chapelle comes back and says, "Ive changed my thinking on x,y,z."

Below you reference a tweet as the funniest trans joke you've seen. I'll admit that I have zero idea what it means. I'm interested to understand it though.

When he says to the trans community to stop punching down at his people, at the end. I think he's referring to comedians as much as anything. Let them do their job. If it's not funny, don't listen. Don't buy a ticket. If nobody watched his specials on Netflix, it would be a hell of a lot more powerful than picketing.

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

Yeah, it wouldn’t surprise me if the majority of those up in arms never watched it

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

Me too! 100%

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Netflix employees walk out to protest Dave Chappelle’s special.

Interesting. The majority of news on the topic that the OP references isn’t about the scary nature of cancel culture or wokeism, but rather about how Chapelle’s standup was bigoted. I heard two stories and a full hour on npr dedicated to this take. I’ve only seen reactions that scorch Chapelle and are generally pretty one sided. But maybe they should be? I’m interested to hear peoples take here.

When I asked “thoughts?” I should have been more specific. Do you believe the special was transphobic? Was it deserving of this reaction?

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Child Brides Who Escaped the FLDS.

I dated a girl that escaped. I had no idea until one night she got very drunk and hid in our closet. I opened the closet door and she was shaking with fear. I had to say, "honey, it's me." and then she snapped out of it and hugged me. After that I noticed things I didn't before. certain scars on her body, etc.

She eventually let me know that her mom was married to her uncle. He married two sisters. I'm 100% sure he raped her too. She escaped though and eventually her mom did too. So fucked up.

I read Under the Banner of Heaven. I recommend it if you want to learn more about this fucked up shit.

thenewgreen  ·  3 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Thomas Jefferson statue coming down in New York's City Council chamber : NPR

I'm sure you've been to Washington DC. I'm sure you've seen the monuments of our founders and those that shaped our countries history. When you were there did the statues make you feel like an outsider or an outcast? Honestly? That's so foreign to me. When I see the statue of MLK I am embolden towards his greatest virtues. When I see the statue of FDR in his wheelchair, and the statue of a family listening to a fireside chat of his, I am reminded that a person, a handicapped man (yes, old and white), helped to steer a country through incredibly dire times. A human. It's right to celebrate each other as humans. I cannot even believe that I am having to have a discussion about it being right and proper to use the art form of sculpture to represent human struggle and achievement. Art has amazing intrinsic value. This statue that started this discussion was commissioned by a Jewish man that felt indebted to Jefferson for fighting for religious freedoms. That story alone has intrinsic value. The debate that this statue has stirred up has intrinsic value.

I can understand having a debate as to weather or not Thomas Jefferson's misdeeds should make us rethink his place in history. But debating the intrinsic value of sculptures of the human experience/form is, to me, bonkers.

thenewgreen  ·  4 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Thomas Jefferson statue coming down in New York's City Council chamber : NPR

I don’t disagree with most of this. However, I do think that as a culture you can revere aspects of people, certain accomplishments and separate them from their shortcomings. I like that we are having this discussion. I think having these statues with the caveat of stating how immensely imperfect the subject is, is valuable. And I did read the article Re the history of this specific statue. My larger concern is where does it start and where does it end? mk made the case better below when he said, if we can only honor people in the whole, then we are trapped in a lie..

thenewgreen  ·  4 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Thomas Jefferson statue coming down in New York's City Council chamber : NPR

The idea came from a man. That man had a life that lead to that idea. That man made choices of study, of pursuit that lead to that idea, that moment, that novel, that piece of music, that speech. Some choices awful, some not. It's right to study men/women for what formed them and their physical form has been a symbol of that journey since we took a chisel to stone.

That said, I worship no man. Quite a different thing to enjoy a statue than to worship its subject. I have always liked the quote from the Buddhist sage, Lin Chi, "If you see the Buddha on the trail. Kill him." To me this has always meant that it's not the Buddha, it's the teachings. It's not the statue, but the journey of the man/woman the statue is meant to portray.

thenewgreen  ·  4 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Thomas Jefferson statue coming down in New York's City Council chamber : NPR

    It has taken me a long time to come around to this way of thought, but I am now convinced that erecting statues of people is a poor option. Glorify their good works, not the person. Teach kids that a HUMAN BEING, JUST LIKE THEM, came up with these good ideas, and they can too! Don't literally put an old white man on a pedestal like he's the only one that could have provided that value to the world. Not only is it untrue, it whitewashes people who were truly terrible human beings.

It is very odd to me that you want children to see that ideas come from humans, but are opposed to showing the statue of the human that conceived of that idea. As for "old" white dudes, Thomas Jefferson was 33 years old when he wrote the declaration of independence. Not exactly a geezer. Is it okay for young white people's ideas to be celebrated? Young hispanic people? Middle aged asian people? Eldery inuits? And if so, why can't those ideas be celebrated with an image of that person? What's wrong with that? Truly baffled. And, btw I am not indoctrinated by any means. I know that the history that was spoon-fed me in my youth was/is immensely propagandized.

    like he's the only one that could have provided that value to the world. Not only is it untrue
- I disagree with this. Often times it is very true. There are men and women of their age that were singular and provided value and ideas that no others could have. Da Vinci, Benjamin Franklin, Beethoven, Shakespeare, O'Keefe. They provided a value that only they could have. It's okay to celebrate exceptionalism and it's okay to call out hypocrisy. But what worries me is the question, who decides? Who are the moral gatekeepers? You? Me? I say let the statue stand and change the placard next to it to make it clear re his accomplishments and shortcomings. Of which there were plenty of both.
thenewgreen  ·  4 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Thomas Jefferson statue coming down in New York's City Council chamber : NPR

This post was about removing a specific statue, not all statues. But, I'll play along.

I think it would have the same detrimental effect to society that waiving a magic wand and eliminating all fountains, all murals or other works of art would have. Statues, at their best are beautiful works of art that convey a message, often but not always of historical significance.

thenewgreen  ·  4 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Thomas Jefferson statue coming down in New York's City Council chamber : NPR

Being left behind? Lol. By whom? I am not afraid of anything. I am disturbed that people can’t recognize the complexity of the human condition. Jefferson himself is an example of hypocrisy and self delusionment. Simultaneously arguing to eradicate slavery and he owned something like 600 slaves.He also largely helped to craft our republic. There’s both good and bad there. Instead of tearing down statues, why not acknowledge that?

And when I talk about myself being ashamed, it largely stems from saying mean things to people when I was a kid. If any of that had been on social media and I ran for office, you can bet they would dredge it up. I’m not a kid anymore, I have changed my thinking and I am less insecure. Now, I understand that comparing that to owning human beings is a stretch. But also comparing 2021 to the 1780s is also a stretch.

I’m disturbed by the far right and the far left these days. This smacks as far left to me.

thenewgreen  ·  15 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Circles

Enjoy your walk! Glad to provide some motivation. If you feel like listening to a song about jealousy and possession, I made this last night:

thenewgreen  ·  15 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Circles

I am excited to see it. Perhaps in person? That would be an awesome way to have a Hubski meet up. If you find a way to sneak in a caribou, I’d be impressed.

thenewgreen  ·  15 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Circles

Yes. That was the reference. It was fun and ridiculous. You should flesh it out into a novel.

thenewgreen  ·  15 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Circles

Thanks! Yes, go create Lil! You are such a gifted artist. Write the great Canadien novel about the caribou. :)

thenewgreen  ·  20 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Andrew Yang's new party will be called 'The Forward Party'

It seems to be to electoral reform and the installation of ranked choice. He was on Anderson Cooper’s show tonight taking about how it can be installed in over half the states without congressional approval and rather simply.