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comment by Grendel
Grendel  ·  3211 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: America's struggle

In my country, I don't know, but Italians used to be an oppressed minority in the USA. Not any more, largely because they changed that perception with the sweat of their hard work. Blacks seem to have decided that it's easier to play the eternal victims. The Irish are another people that suffered discrimination at the hands of Americans, and survived to tell the tale. More than anything, the black community seems to be the victim of its own mentality, of which the OP is an example. Bill Cosby agrees with me.





kleinbl00  ·  3210 days ago  ·  link  ·  

An Italian who comes to America has an accent. His children don't. They can oppress the Germans.

A German who comes to America has an accent. His children don't. They can oppress the Chinese.

A Chinese who comes to America has an accent. His children won't. They can oppress the Mexicans.

A Mexican who comes to America has an accent. HIs children won't. They can oppress the blacks.

And the fucked up thing is the blacks have been here longer than any of them.

All of the above except the Chinese pass as white as soon as they lose the accent. The Chinese? Well, "asian" isn't exactly an unoppressed minority but asians have only been grossly mistreated and taken advantage of in the United States. They've never been out-and-out owned. Meanwhile, the Reconstruction south wasn't slavery but it sure as hell was Apartheid and baseball went color a mere six years before television so it's not like the US has a storied history of color-blindness. But that's okay because, you know, Bill Cosby.

There's a difference between "stop perpetuating the stereotype" and "stop getting shot by cops." No one is denying correlation; we're arguing that it's a long goddamn way from 100%.

Grendel  ·  3210 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Just so you know, Italians and Mexicans are not universally recognised as white even today (this is the first time I talk to someone who thinks of Mexicans as white). The Irish were sold as slaves in the hundreds of thousands. Chinese people could also end up being slaves, and in general were second class citizens at best.

It's fucking sad how you feel the need to downplay the misfortunes of other groups just so you can cling to the belief that blacks are the most oppressed, the biggest victims, the quintessential minority. Even some members of the black community are getting sick and tired of this attitude, and that's saying something! The very people who risk getting shot by the cops by virtue of their skin colour are saying "stop blaming everything on racism, and start fixing yourselves."

_refugee_  ·  3209 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Just so you know, Italians and Mexicans are not universally recognised as white even today

Cool. Last time I checked tho we were talking about 'Murrica. Fuck yeah!

ButterflyEffect  ·  3211 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Not any more, largely because they changed that perception with the sweat of their hard work.

Oh, I see, so if only African-Americans continued working hard and sweating in the fields the whole slavery problem would have sorted itself out. If only somebody had this kind of attitude in the mid 19th century, we could have avoided the Civil War.

Grendel  ·  3211 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Well, you asked a question, you got an answer. My point is that blacks are not the only group that started at the bottom of the social ladder, but as far as I know, they're the only ones who refuse to climb it. For many of them, crime seems to have become part of their identity. Even if white-on-black racism were to completely disappear tomorrow, blacks would continue to blame their problems on the racist crackas and their history of slavery.

arguewithatree  ·  3210 days ago  ·  link  ·  

This is hilariously misguided. White on white homicide occurs at the same rate, and black on black crime has decreased significantly in the last 40 years. (FBI)

additionally, your hypothetical statement about racism disappearing tomorrow is incredibly flawed. I'm not sure how you're defining racism, but it would be impossible to undo the systemically racist features of society in a single day without causing massive structural upheaval so until you elaborate on this, I can't respond

tacocat  ·  3210 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I think they lost that perception when they became acceptably white. The Irish used to be oppressed here too. And Catholics weren't seen very highly. And tell me about the laws that kept the Irish from voting. And the all Irish public schools. I missed those history lessons but I heard about that happening to black people a generation ago.

If you look white there's really no way to assess specific European ethnicity in America aside from maybe your last name. I have a Scottish last name but I'm mostly English. And when did agreeing with Bill Cosby's smug ass become a positive for anyone? It's not even a positive for Jello anymore.