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comment by blackbootz
blackbootz  ·  2790 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: What Are Young Men Doing?

I don't know. While on the one hand, I agree with you that there's a surfeit of idle hands, on the other I can't help but feel that blame isn't entirely on them. I have wonderful parents, a wonderful mom at least, who imparted work ethic and self-improvement, love for others, and esteem for education. And I still barely beat my video game addiction.

I remember wanting sorely a channel of meaningful activity. It was an intense hunger. And it took a constellation of lucky circumstances to get me to where I'm at (though I'm still hungry for more). It's easy to hate on man-children and dudebros, but the problem is widespread enough to warrant a look at systemic factors.





user-inactivated  ·  2790 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    It's easy to hate on man-children and dudebros, but the problem is widespread enough to warrant a look at systemic factors.

goobster  ·  2790 days ago  ·  link  ·  

The world is not a safe place, and it guarantees you nothing.

If someone choose to spend their time sitting on the couch playing video games, then they will have a certain type of life.

Being upset about that life, once they have gone through all that non-effort to create it, is not my problem.

Blame video games, or TV (in my day), or cars (in my Dad's day), or cities (in my Grandparent's days), but there are people who choose not to participate in life. You can't make them get off the couch and join the world. They simply have to reach bottom, become disgusted with the meaninglessness of it all, and then either off themselves, or get up and do something.

Your "constellation of lucky circumstances" is just the path you travelled. I can choose to view my life the same way. The fact is that you and I chose NOT to sit on the couch and veg.

oyster  ·  2790 days ago  ·  link  ·  

When I worked in Alberta a lot of the locals I worked with had drug problems, didn't show up to work, didn't work hard and in general sucked. For a long time it bothered me, like I can come to work and work hard, why the hell can't they ? It pissed me off that they chose to be that way. Then one day I realized that person who chose to work hard (me) was nothing but a collection of experiences and interactions with other people. That's all we are really, everything about me was given to me. Realizing that was incredibly humbling. These people I was angry with for being the way they are are nothing more than a reflection of experiences and interactions. Would I be the same person I am had I started life in their place ? Would I have my same behaviors, values, or desires ? No, I wouldn't because there is no "me" outside of the life I have lived.

People often think well I had it bad too but I still chose better. Thing is though if all we are is our experiences then something had to happen to put us on that path of doing better. If we all start off as squishy little brains ready to be molded then that's the only way it can work.

So something happened in my life to put me on this path and something didn't happen in the lives of others which caused them to resort to escapism as a coping method. We can either bitch and moan about those damn youths or we, as a society, can try to figure out what that something is.

goobster  ·  2789 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Yes. 1000% yes!

Man... there's a lot to unpack here. RD95 just got childish and whiny and wound up blocking me. Which is a blessing because now I don't have to listen to him/her whine about the way the world is, without offering any solutions!

So yeah... something did happen in our lives, and you and I wound up not being lazy couchlumps. But I would guess that if we were able to pick apart a couchlump's life, they had opportunities as well, and simply didn't take them, or didn't capitalize on them. That happens. A lot. To all of us. What makes you and I different is that we continued to work the angles until something clicked.

And THAT is the "constellation of lucky circumstances", that you referred to, I think.

Now, there are also societal problems, mental problems, community problems, and a whole constellation of bad circumstances out there that affect people every day, as well. And maybe there are some who have bought in to the narrative that they are oppressed or disempowered or disenfranchised and have used those excuses to flake out.

That's the real problem here: shit's complex. It's not a simple cause-and-effect relationship, but a network effect of big and little things over time.

All we can do, I think, is for each of us to work on our own circle of influence to make shit better for everyone in our circle. Just keep Doing Good for people. If we all keep it up, hopefully we can have a positive effect on people.

I know I have. I get thanks for my help regularly. And that's a pretty goddamn wonderful feeling, my friend! Brings a smile to my face as I write this, even...

oyster  ·  2789 days ago  ·  link  ·  

When I say our world shapes everything we are I mean everything. So something happened that caused us to develop whatever trait was responsible for us pushing through shit and working hard. Or grabbing those opportunities others pass up. We didn't give up because something kept us going. Something showed us it was worth it. I'm only 23, maybe I will give up a few years from now and end up in crap circumstances. I don't know what my life holds. I do know that it can be pretty damm difficult to get the life many people where told to want through out their adolescence. Really it's near impossible for most people. The only reason that doesn't drag me down mentally is because I don't want anything to do with that BS. But if I believed the adults who told me to aim for that and I placed my entire self worth on my ability to achieve it ? I would probably be in a pretty low place right about now.

snoodog  ·  2789 days ago  ·  link  ·  

The question though is did working hard change your outcome as opposed to not working hard. If not working hard provides the same outcome as working hard then you gotta ask yourself who is the greater fool?

oyster  ·  2789 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I did wonder that at times and in that situation I still see myself coming out on top. Showing up every day and working hard is rewarding. It makes me feel good and I think it makes others feel good too. So sure I was irritated in the morning wondering who would show up and tired by the end of the day from picking up the extra work but I actually liked myself. At the end of the day I liked being who I was. People who for whatever reason get stuck in a position where hard work doesn't seem worth it or just can't work much generally feel like shit about themselves. I'll take my situation over that any day. I wouldn't have always but when you have a really simple job you have a lot of time to think.

goobster  ·  2789 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Gah. I know!

I've got a few of those friends. People who are skilled, talented, and just get the shaft all the time. They work hard. They do good work. And then get hit by a meteor, or something. Just crazy shit happens to them all the time and sets them back again. They get two steps forward and get knocked three steps back.

I went through that for a number of years, once. It became comical. Everything I touched turned to shit. I could type "2+2" into a calculator and get "-9403" as an answer. It was ridiculous. But now, looking at it from 10 years in the future, I also see how it formed me, and made me who I am today.

Hard work generally pays off, but the timeline might not be what one was hoping for...

bioemerl  ·  2789 days ago  ·  link  ·  
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