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comment by b_b
b_b  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Falluja’s Fall Stuns Marines Who Fought There

If it wasn't clear already that the Iraq war was fought in vain...





user-inactivated  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·  

What do you think about the few marines who are laying blame at Obama's doorstep for pulling out too early and "allowing this to happen"?

Total lose/lose scenario for everyone.

cgod  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Iraq refused to sign a status of forces agreement making U.S. soldiers chargeable for war crimes. I believe that under U.S. law forces must operate under a status of forces agreement if they aren't acting under a declaration of war.

Leading up to the failure to renegotiate a status of forces agreement every commentator I heard said that if they Iraqis wouldn't sign then the U.S. would be forced to leave the country.

I don't think Obama had that near as much to do with it as Iraqi politics did.

You don't hear anyone really admitting that we got kicked out of Iraq aside from deep military wonks but that is pretty much what happened.

b_b  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I have no idea about how the political situation here has affected the reality on the ground there. I think it's impossible for any of us to know. Do I think generally that Obama's wishy-washiness has led to some big clusterfucks? Yes. I just have no idea if this is one of them. Either way you're right; it's a huge lose/lose.

cgod  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·  

In what ways do you think he was "wishy-washy?"

Seems to me that he gave all three of his major conflicts a pretty hefty push before he got kicked out of Iraq and decided to call it in Afghanistan. He is still aggressively pushing drone strikes, murder and surveillance in his third campaign against terrorism and decency.

JackTheBandit  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·  

but thats the thing. What was there to ever WIN exactly? How do we wage "war" on a concept, an idea, like "terrorism?" I have trouble grasping the concept..

user-inactivated  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Only initial public opinion. Which was rapidly lost, as anyone could have predicted.

b_b  ·  3973 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Yes, that's why I said above that the war was fought in vain from the outset. These new developments only solidify that view.