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comment by Quatrarius
Quatrarius  ·  3510 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Why L, G, B, and T together?

I think that the things that you're discounting are the important factors here. Issues that negatively affect transgender people (bigotry, violence, discrimination. as you said) also affect LGB people and spring from similar causes. It's more of a "stronger together" sort of idea going on. You're right in saying that the specifics aren't the same, but they're similar enough so that it'd make sense to work united on them.

(I don't follow the politics of it. These are just my personal thoughts.)





steve  ·  3510 days ago  ·  link  ·  

crap... I worried that what I wrote about commonalities might be read as me discounting them. I don't mean to write them off. All of these groups have been and are being marginalized in many ways. I just wonder if it's time to take the discussion to the next level and look more closely at issues facing all groups.

maybe I've got the cart before the horse. Shoot... "There aren't gay people in Russia", right? One step at a time toward a world where people are truly free to be and love whoever they want.

kingmudsy  ·  3509 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I wouldn't worry about anyone losing faith in you as a person or anything. You're coming here with a very obvious tone of, "I don't know this! Is someone able to explain it to me?" More importantly, you're not arguing with people who are trying to explain it to you, which is something I see all the time on posts like this.

That said, I disagree and think that the T should be kept in the acronym, and I would probably argue that it does less to marginalize transgender individuals than you think it does. If anything, I imagine it binds them to the LGB community, which gains them an important ally in the political sense.

Of course, I'm also a white heterosexual male, so anyone who actually knows how it is can feel free to correct me!

steve  ·  3509 days ago  ·  link  ·  

So.... upon further thought - and after reading all of these awesome responses, I should have probably titled this post differently.

I understand why the Ts are part of the LGBT movement.

I don't mean to marginalize Trans people (or anyone for that matter) further by trying to break them apart.

I guess I was trying to look further - maybe look at the next step where LGBT folks no longer have to fight for basic rights and even survival - but the next phase when they can begin to focus on some of the nuance of what it means to be Trans that differ from the LGB movement.

Hmmm... it's kinda hard to put all of my thoughts and feelings into these comments while I'm at work. (who does my boss think he is anyway - expecting me to finish stuff while I'm at WORK :-P) I just envision this place, in the not-to-distant future where people can be who they want and love who they want and marry who they want with no fear of actual persecution, violence, discrimination, etc. There will always be haters... there will be people who civilly disagree with lifestyle choices... but I can hope.

blergh. then we'll move on to world peace.

kingmudsy  ·  3509 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Nah, I actually think the sentiment is very nice! And I think once we get to that point, we'll see the T in LGBT become the focus, just as the LGB part has been in this last decade. A guy can hope, anyways.

empty  ·  3510 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Quats, you surprise me in all the right ways tonight. :)

Quatrarius  ·  3505 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Why was that a surprise?

empty  ·  3505 days ago  ·  link  ·  

TBH it's because a lot of the time you put your foot in your mouth or can be insensitive. When we first met you shared some shitty opinions on gender identity, but this post is thoughtful and shows insight into the nature of identity politics, which insight normally goes over most people's heads.

Quatrarius  ·  3505 days ago  ·  link  ·  

i can't remember even a quarter of the things i say but i believe you that it happened

i agree with you on your first two points; been attempting to dial back on comments on here for those reasons

i'm sorry if whatever i said hurt you personally - i know how it feels and i don't mean to add to anybody's pain