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comment by bioemerl
bioemerl  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Obama's Free Community College Might Be A Good Idea, Might Be A Bad One

Or you manage to get lucky and go into a degree/career that pays well with a lot of jobs. AKA IT.





ButterflyEffect  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

That doesn't change the fact that many of those people will be leaving with a lot of debt. Will they be able to pay it off? Sure. But it will still be much higher than previous generations have had to deal with for many of those students.

Also, I'm having trouble finding how many people study IT in particular, but the total number of Computer and information sciences bachelor's degrees awarded in 2011-2012 was 47,384, or 2.65%. A small fraction, no doubt. I'm aware that not everybody can "get lucky" or base their profession off the pay grade, but I do think college should be much cheaper than it is now or that loan forgiveness shouldn't be completely out of the realm of possibility.

bioemerl  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

There are other good careers rather than IT.

I agree that college should be cheaper. I also think that, rather than loan forgiveness, people should be able to decide to pay a "college tax" on their earnings (5%?) while the debt they have remains static, with zero interest, and can be paid off to lose the tax.

Forgiveness could cause issues depending on how it is done, as can ending the ability to get loans. There needs to be some sort of system that stops ballooning prices at least.

user-inactivated  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Is that luck, or choice?

bioemerl  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

A little of both.

Lots of people choosing to go into game design, to follow their dreams.

They will be dreaming of no debt, despite being very close to a very well hiring career path.

user-inactivated  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Are you speaking from experience?

bioemerl  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Not at all. Just from what I have heard from other sources.

user-inactivated  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Mmhhhhm.

bioemerl  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I have no idea what you are trying to say or imply.

user-inactivated  ·  3660 days ago  ·  link  ·  

It's not personal, but I don't like the "despair narrative" unless it's coming from a sufferer. That "mmhhhm" sounds more dickish once it's out of my head though.

_refugee_  ·  3658 days ago  ·  link  ·  

That's silly. Facts are real regardless of whether the person speaking them has experienced them firsthand or merely learned them. And anecdotes should not be taken wholesale as shining examples of how things really are for the general population or sub-population being discussed.

If you heard that certain job fields were not hiring would you refuse to believe it until you heard it from someone who applied for those sorts of jobs? Would you take the time to peruse his/her resume or hear his job history to try and determine if he/she was actually qualified for the positions they applied for after listening to their despair narrative or would you simply trust them, because they had experienced it firsthand? Would articles about how those fields are not hiring be dismissed as "not coming from sufferers"?

Sure, first-hand experience can provide a perspective, and even a valuable one in the right circumstances. But it's not the only way to acquire information and facts, or to justify them. Sometimes anecdotes are completely off-base. I got hired two months after stopping college, with no degree, making over 30k a year, in a field in which I had no experience and which was not related to my degree, at the age of 20, in the freaking summer of 2010, in the United States. For reference, the unemployment rate across the nation was 9.5% that summer. Does my experience (while certainly not a 'despair narrative') corroborate with any facts of the job market at the time for the standard American? No, not at all. Likewise, one person's "despair narrative" may be completely skewed from the norm, or skewed by their perspective.

Moreover, I don't feel the need to shore up my belief that some things are awful/worthy of despair by waving around my personal experience of them, nor should I.