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comment by user-inactivated
user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: June 12, 2016 Orlando Nightclub Shooting, discussion

    Christianity has had its fangs pulled, it's claws removed and it's balls cut off. Islam has yet to be civilized in such a manner.

This is clearly true, to anyone who studies history and does not major in theory of religious equality, or whatever. However you will be hard-pressed to find agreement here or anywhere else. It is an ugly truth and has no ready solution.

That said, the problem with mass shootings in the US is mental illness, not Islam. Broadly speaking.





user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

As a student of history you are of course aware of who kept civilization going while Christianity was clawing up the furniture and pissing on the carpets in Europe. "That's not fair, that wasn't about religion, that was about politics, see Christianity was a better method of social control than the big mess of every conquered people's religions that preceded it because a monotheistic state religion doesn't leave room for dissent and it was close enough to the cult of Mithras to not alienate the army, so it was encouraged to be violent and repressive from the start to keep the proles in line and that was ingrained by the time it was all that was left of the Empire..." Sure, but using most of the Middle East as proxies for the cold war was politics too.

user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Who knows what I'm aware of, really.

    As a student of history you are of course aware of who kept civilization going while Christianity was clawing up the furniture and pissing on the carpets in Europe.

The problem with saying things like this is that it reinforces surface-level history, and people share it, and then other people come later and read it, etc, etc. It is a vast oversimplification. However, I'm not about to take you to task for that because I oversimplify every single post I make on purpose, mostly to see who I can provoke into spewing bullshit. Tonight I was hoping someone would wander by who had majored in theory of religious equality but no dice.

Anyway, it continues to take a hell of a lot of rationalization to mount what might be called the progressive position in this particular debate.

Aside, I don't think Mithras gets mentioned enough. Something that should be on everyone's bucket list is the Vatican Necropolis, which shelters a lot of "pagan" rock drawings which were possibly/probably Mithraic. It's literally directly under the high seat of Catholicism on earth. That's so fantasy.

user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  
user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  
user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Epidemiologic studies show that the large majority of people with serious mental illnesses are never violent.

This is so bitterly, hilariously, obviously different than saying 'most mass shootings are perpetrated by people non compos mentis'.

Withal, in my life I have read a great many studies focusing on humans and the conclusion I have drawn more than any other is -- studying humans is flawed and difficult. I choose to fall back, as ever, on common sense.

OftenBen  ·  3167 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    on common sense.

Beg pardon?

My common sense says that anyone who draws a picture of my deity deserves immediate severe punishment.

Obviously.

user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    This is so bitterly, hilariously, obviously different than saying 'most mass shootings are perpetrated by people non compos mantis'.

Yes. You're right. That's the point. Call me dense, but I don't see your point.

If anything, the only thing I'm gathering from this is that you're pulling on your own readings of studies - which, I wholeheartedly agree are inevitably bound to be bias, fragmented, or otherwise - from these studies you've decided leave it to your own beliefs of common sense... which is a variable to culture?

snoodog  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    US is mental illness, not Islam

That's also the only real issue that we can address coming out of this. We can as a country work towards getting better more sane laws, programs and systems for dealing with mental illness. Unfortunately I dont think politicians are really all that interested in solving the mental illness problems and are instead more interested in blaming guns (Democrats) and Islamic terrorists (Republicans) .

user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

We used to have them. Or at least we used to face the problem more realistically.

Luckily, the drugs really do seem to be improving as far as I've observed.

snoodog  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I see it more as both an access to care issue, but also as a we need for better ways to contain people if they are going batshit and refusing to take their meds. Jail really isn't a good substitute for mental care.

user-inactivated  ·  3168 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I'd like to see evidence of mental health being the sum of the problem at hand. As it stands, I can find many opinionated articles and public figures supporting as such. On the other hand, research and reports including input from experts in the field vehemently arguing otherwise.