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comment by ecib
ecib  ·  3931 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Lil's Book of Questions: When Have You Felt Most Spiritual?

I'm an atheist and the absolute zero of spirituality, but I understand what it is to know and not just believe with all my heart that God is real.

I was raised Christian, and for the first third of my life I took it to heart. My family went to church and sent me to a Catholic school, but out of that there was never any saying of grace at meals, calls to pray before bed or any other time, nor were there isolationist comments made about the religious character of friends or anyone else. In short, observant, but mellow. Actually, as a Catholic, they were lucky to even get the observant part of us.

Anyway, I took it seriously on my own, well above what was asked or demanded of me from my parents or teachers. I prayed by myself at night in bed, and I remember well the physical and emotional feelings that washed over me in times of communion. I remember the distinction between belief, and what I had, which was certain knowledge. This is one thing that I think many atheists that have never been very religious struggle with grasping:

They see faith in others as a manifestation of belief. They say "even the word faith implies belief in absence of proof."

Like that matters.

What they don't realize is that to us, faith represented knowledge that was actually stronger and more self evident than a collection of empirical evidence. It was quite simply truer than the Sun always rising in the East.

It's why I don't argue with theists unless we both realize that neither of us is actually trying to convince the other of anything (in that case, let's shoot the shit if I've got nothing better to do).

I'm lucky that I've always been curious and introspective. My faith couldn't survive me looking directly at it in an uncompromising way (my purposeful quest to understand the incredible deepness of my faith is what led to its destruction).

So that was it. That was the last time I felt most spiritual. Somewhere around 15 years of age I'd say. It wasn't anything positive or particularly destructive. Just very intense and misinformed, though there is something to be said for knowing that the omnipotent creator of the Universe personally wants you to succeed. I think the placebo effect is serving a lot of people out there very well.





lil  ·  3931 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    faith represented knowledge that was actually stronger and more self evident than a collection of empirical evidence.
You express that very well. Somewhere around the age of 15 you seem to have broken the spell. Were you relieved to free yourself from that belief system? Do you ever miss the placebo effect? My guess: You miss it not one iota.
ecib  ·  3928 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Were you relieved to free yourself from that belief system?

The opposite. I felt tremendous guilt and shame. You have to remember that God was a real person, and it felt like I was betraying him...even though I didn't believe in him. Also I was turning my back on a good portion of my entire upbringing and what all the adults around me told me what being a good person was all about.

But that was short term. After that it was great. Basically just felt refreshing and nice to not live with the yoke of guilt and self-hate that that my religion preached from childhood. Just being able to have normal human thoughts regarding things like sex without being made to feel bad about it.

    Do you ever miss the placebo effect?

No. Because the cost of gaining the Placebo of a supernatural guide is that you have to view yourself as inherently corrupt and sinful. You have to refrain from a whole range of healthy natural human behaviors. You have to believe that other human beings like gay people are corrupt and immoral people, and most damning of all, you must possess a bias against critical thinking. Fuck that on every level.