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comment by coffeesp00ns

This shit's fucked up, fam.

I'll be straight with you, all the people who I know who are boosting stories like this are intersectional feminists and queer voices. I also think it says something that her own fans called her out on her bullshit.You know who I don't see talking about this shit? average dudes.




francopoli  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

We are in the middle of a suicide epidemic, and nobody gives a shit. Suicide is the second leading cause of death of male teenagers in the USA according to the CDC. More US military kill themselves than die in combat, by a factor of three. Some 3/4 of all firearm fatalities are suicides. More men kill themselves than are killed in car accidents and homicide, combined.

Bring any of this up and if you get a reaction at all, depending on the crowd you are with, you get silence, indifference, 'They should all have manned up' or some nonsense along those lines, or laughter.

    You know who I don't see talking about this shit? average dudes.

Because any time us average dudes try to have a conversation about stuff like this we are accused of "mansplaining" or silencing marginalized voices or some garbage. One guy I knew back in the early 90's went to a mental health clinic to seek help for suicidal thoughts; the therapist felt he was a danger and reported him to the police. He did a year in jail as a 'threat to the community' and killed himself when he got out. At least in my friend groups we all know the universal truth is that nobody gives a shit if guys like us have problems. My friends have been down this road enough times with enough people we know that we all look for the signs of someone on the edge and deal with helping as best we can. Average dudes who have watched good people slip away all know nobody cares, so why bother talking?

coffeesp00ns  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I mean, I literally just told you that I personally know people who are signal boosting these stories, who are involved in activism, who are the kind of people who tell all their friends before major holidays to save the fireworks so the veterans in the area don't have to find a dark, quiet place to hide.

The people in my community who are advocating for physical doctors to listen to women when they're in pain are the same people who are advocating for mental health doctors and psychologists to listen to men when they're in pain. The rate of suicide in men is absolutely gobsmacking. So is the rate of suicide for children under the age of 13.

What drove me to comment as I did is that so often, these stories come with an unspoken (or sometimes explicitly spoken) tag line of "and where are the feminists who say they're for equality?" When it happens, it always comes off to me like the News commentators who ask about black-on-black violence after a white cop kills a black kid.

And in some cases, it's well warranted because there are some shit people who claim feminism. Germaine Greer, for example, is a shit feminist. But again, I need to reinforce that the only people I see talking about these stories are intersectional feminists and queer people. These are the people I see helping people with mental health issues, helping veterans and sexual assault survivors with PTSD. And they're the people who I see get made fun of for creating "safe spaces" where people can talk about their shit, where they know and accept that the concepts like "manning up" are a result of toxic masculinity, a type of masculinity that says men are not allowed to show any emotion other than derision and rage.

And these are also the voices that mainstream culture and mainstream politics are doing their best to squeeze out.

francopoli  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    What drove me to comment as I did is that so often, these stories come with an unspoken (or sometimes explicitly spoken) tag line of "and where are the feminists who say they're for equality?" When it happens, it always comes off to me like the News commentators who ask about black-on-black violence after a white cop kills a black kid.

Then I did not comprehend a meaning correctly. That's on me.

    But again, I need to reinforce that the only people I see talking about these stories are intersectional feminists and queer people.

Then you must be looking in online spaces. Guys don't talk about shit like this in public forums because anyone running a background check on your for a job, security clearance, etc that finds posts about you talking about self harm and suicide? You don't get the job. Even these posts, if found by a company running a background check, could be career death for me. There are things I'd love to talk about but do not dare say here because Hubski is google indexed and will show up in spot #1 on any search of my name.

But back to the topic you bring up. Men don't talk about this shit in public because nobody gives a shit if men kill themselves, so why bother. And if they do, a major spotlight ends up right in their face and nobody wants that.

coffeesp00ns  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

These people (myself included) are advocating for better mental health access for men online and in real life. I've got a brother who came home from the military with a lot of mental health issues, and I do my best to be an ally and advocate for him in particular. It makes me sad that you don't believe me, but I'm not going to push this any further.

francopoli  ·  42 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    It makes me sad that you don't believe me, but I'm not going to push this any further.

Never said I don't believe you. You and I appear to be having two separate conversations. It happens in text based communications. Hope the bother is doing well.

johnnyFive  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    He did a year in jail as a 'threat to the community'....

Sadly, this is still an ongoing thing. I should add that this is the case of Chelsea Manning, but I think it points to the broader issue of poor handling of mental health.

ThatFanficGuy  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

At least we know this shit happens. Could you have had that 50 years ago?

I'm not saying it isn't a tragedy, nor am I saying we shouldn't worry about it 'cause it's better than it was before. But shit, it is better than it was before. It's progress. Slow, painful, but inevitable.

WanderingEng  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Did you see Anthony Bourdain killed himself yesterday?

francopoli  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I've watched people have the conversation of "Wow he was rich and had women fawning over him, and he killed himself? What hope is there for me?"

So now I gotta watch the people I care about . Looks like a great weekend to fuck off the internet.

coffeesp00ns  ·  44 days ago  ·  link  ·  

fuck, him and Kate Spade in one week.

He was a great example for a lot of people I know who worked in kitchens, trying to get clean. My heart goes out to his kids, especially. He never struck me as a perfect person, but he definitely struck me as a person who tried to be better.