Really, if you want to look knowledgeable while slagging on contemporary art, focus on Tracy Emin. But remember - good artists borrow, great artists steal.

I do not like anything I read about either of those two people. Or any of these guys. The Piss Christ I brought up cause it's the only example I could remember, but it also fits right along with these guys. I just want to say, in all fairness, I don't want to start the whole "What is Art?" debate. I hate that debate. It's been done over and over and the more involved people get in it, the less happy everyone seems to walk away from it. I remember one time at a barbecue talking to a guy about Vintage Monaco Posters and how even though I wouldn't actively search for a real one, I wouldn't mind having a reprint of one hanging on my walls. He said, in summary, that they're not real art and I should feel guilty for thinking that they were. I said, in summary, that he's a pompous fuckhead and he should feel guilty for saying that I should feel guilty for enjoying what I enjoy. On the flip side, if he told me about these artists with the toilets and the beds and he was genuinely enthusiastic about what they were doing and wanted to share why, I'd be all ears. In a nutshell, that's generally how it seems to go with me discussing art with people. It's not fun. I've had similar conversations about antiques, music, books, what have you. You don't have to like what I like, but you shouldn't have to make me feel guilty for liking what I like or feel compelled to have a drawn out, pseudo-intellectual conversation to defend my tastes. That's assholish.

I think that's the thing though. You say with hipsters and their behavior, there's no "victim." I mean, yeah, in a way you're right. The barista didn't shoot you in the back at the coffee place. No one at a barbecue that I've ever been at could be held directly responsible for slave labor in South America. On much smaller scale though, the attitudes they have make people who they think aren't on the "in" feel marginalized. They can make people feel that their life experiences, their tastes and preferences, are diminished in value. Those are negative experiences. That's victimization in a way. You? Me? We take the high road. We think those people might be having an off day at best or write them off as jerks at the worse. Some people though? They're pretty thin skinned. Having to go through conversations like that sucks.

The other problem is, these attitudes can lead to real and true discrimination. Take my friend's father for example. Awesome guy, in his mid 60s, loves classic movies with the likes of Cary Grant, Spencer Tracy, Paul Newman, Jimmy Stewart, etc. He knows his country music like the back of his hand, thinks Texas Swing is one of the coolest things ever just by how it happened to come about. He's an awesome, awesome guy and a great conversationalist. He's also old, goofy looking, and speaks with a bit of a stutter. There was a burger place near where he worked that he heard good things about. Great food, run by cool young college people, a place that's really worthwhile to eat. He got absolutely shit service. Now, he's not the kind of guy to complain ever, but he complained about that to his son and I. So we decided to check the place out ourselves. The two of us? Definitely don't dress the part of young or cool either, and we too got shit service. People that dressed the part of the "stereotypical" hipster got checked on by their waitress twice as often as us (yes, we kept track), had the waitress talk to those customers what at least seemed longer, and the overall attitude towards those customers seemed more friendly, warm, and receptive compared to what we got. Anecdotal, I know. While I'm sure that such an experience doesn't happen often, the fact that it happens at all is shitty.

I dunno. I read the comment of yours from a ways back that you referred to, arguing that hipsters don't exist. I'd argue against it, saying that just because they don't want to call themselves that, doesn't mean that they can't be categorized under that term. I'd agree with the frailty though. Through and through. It strikes me that people with low confidence place too much value on what they know and the things they surround themselves with, as well as their own perception of self. It doesn't excuse the behavior though.

As an aside. Fuck. I'm really sorry. I didn't mean to rant or debate you. It just kind of came out.