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comment by OftenBen
OftenBen  ·  1993 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Large Majorities Dislike Political Correctness - The Atlantic

    it doesn't automatically follow that the answer is "do nothing."

Good thing that's not what I advocate for.

Learning to be thick-skinned and hard to offend is definitely not a 'do nothing' approach.

It's damn difficult and even suggesting it is unpopular.

For some reason we are dead set on giving words all this extra power and by extension give tons of power to those who get off on using offensive language.

Trump, and those who think/act/talk like him are empowered by how easy it is to offend anyone to the left of center. They can do nothing except say one shocking, offensive thing, and all of a sudden it's the only thing that anyone can talk about for a week while other nefarious shit goes on behind the scenes.





johnnyFive  ·  1993 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I get all this, but I don't think it's realisitic to just pretend that words don't mean anything, either.

OftenBen  ·  1993 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I'm not pretending anything.

I am refusing to take offense when cretins try to give it out.

The other option is death to cretins. It might not start out that way, but that's where we would end up.

johnnyFive  ·  1993 days ago  ·  link  ·  

That's your choice of course, but I haven't seen a reason that everyone should follow it (which is more where I was going). I also think your prediction is hyperbolic.

OftenBen  ·  1992 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I'm always happy to hear alternatives.

The parties in question are those who are taking offense and those who are giving it.

Despite our best intentions and hopes Trump and Company are going to continue doing exactly what they've been doing because they've been successful doing it. The choice that we are faced with is to either allow it to have the desired effect or not.

johnnyFive  ·  1991 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Sure, but you can only do what you can do. Other people being assholes doesn't mean I get to be.

OftenBen  ·  1991 days ago  ·  link  ·  

So what are you going to do?

johnnyFive  ·  1989 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Not use terminology that I think has bad connotations.

OftenBen  ·  1989 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Watch tacocat's link if you haven't already

johnnyFive  ·  1988 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I have, and it hasn't changed my opinion. I don't think his description of this consistent cycle is accurate: I've never heard anyone use any of the currently-used technical terms as a synonym for "stupid." The cycle pretty much ended with the word retarded.

I think y'all are simply choosing to ignore how it's actually used. It's used to say "you being stupid is you being like this other person with a mental condition." Since this kind of logic is generally communative, I don't think it's unreasonable for it to be seen as implying that someone with one of these conditions is insult-worthy per se. You can say an association shouldn't exist, but that's academic: the point is that it does. That's how language works.

A good example of this is the word "niggardly." It has nothing to do with the racial slur, has a totally different etymology (it comes via Scandinavian languages versus the slur being based on Romance ones), but given its effect, it's something that most people avoid using now. See also: "nimrod," which literally went from meaning "a great hunter" to "stupid" thanks to a massive misunderstanding of a Bugs Bunny cartoon.

Regardless of the reasoning, there's a degree of selfishness involved. You're basically saying "I won't change my speech pattern even though it's hurtful to someone else." Sure, anything can be taken too far, and some of this is simply a matter of general societal agreement that is not perfect. But are you really saying that you're so inconvenienced by having to use a different word, to the point that it overrides the very real hurt felt by someone with such a condition or their loved ones? Even if we set aside the way it's used (and what thus makes it different), is it really so important to you that you're cool with being an asshole to someone who doesn't deserve it just so you get to use this one specific word?

This is why the "anti-PC" crowd gets a bad rap, because my experience has overwhelmingly been that it's people being upset that they're not allowed to be shitty to someone else like they used to.

OftenBen  ·  1985 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Who am I trying to be shitty to?

johnnyFive  ·  1981 days ago  ·  link  ·  

That was a more general thing about the whole idea of being "anti-PC" or whatever. So my comment to you more specifically was to question why it's okay to use a term that many would regard as offensive for little gain, at least that I can see.

OftenBen  ·  1970 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I'm still waiting to hear an alternative.

tacocat  ·  1988 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I've heard special needs used as an insult. I haven't heard anyone go to Stanhope's lengths.

I've not really followed this whole conversation but check this out:

https://www.themarysue.com/sarah-palin-son-instagram/

That lady is a piece of work.

johnnyFive  ·  1981 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Wow, that is horrifying.

tacocat  ·  1981 days ago  ·  link  ·  

And I honestly can't tell if she's too stupid to know why that's awful or cynical and awful enough to do it anyway

johnnyFive  ·  1981 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I've been having that internal debate a lot lately. I feel like it probably starts as cynicism and then just sort of becomes the person after awhile.

tacocat  ·  1981 days ago  ·  link  ·  
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