That's not a discussion, that's a narrative. That someone was hurt by what you said does not automatically mean that you "fucked up". Individual feelings don't magically override every other thing in the world. If you're in a comedy club and a comedian makes a joke that upsets you, well, you're in a comedy club. It's not about you being upset, it's about the comedian making people laugh. If you're so upset that you can't enjoy it you should leave. It's unfortunate that you're upset but it doesn't mean the comedian made a mistake. If you're in a classroom and someone says something you disagree with and it makes you uncomfortable, that doesn't mean they fucked up either! You're taking part in an environment that promotes the exchange of ideas for educational purposes. If you're afraid of being exposed to ideas that you may disagree with, it's not the place for you. That some of us may be fragile does not mean that the rest of the world must come to a halt. It means that you'd better go buy yourself a nice padded suit, or hang out in a padded room, or buck up.
You're right, individual feelings don't magically override every other thing in the world and that's why if you do something that hurts someone else, then that's traditionally considered a "fuck up" - i.e. a mistake that hurt someone (assuming they weren't intentionally trying to hurt someone, as that wouldn't be a mistake). I don't see the distinction you're making here. If someone goes to a comedy club expecting a funny night out, and the comedian starts joking about something that seriously affects them (like a rape joke), then they'll usually leave or keep quiet anyway because they're upset. But that doesn't mean the comedian didn't fuck up. Sure, I'm assuming here that people don't intentionally want to hurt others and in that case doing something which you think is harmless, that ends up harming others, would be a fuck up. Suppose I have a clown act and people come to see my show. At one point I squirt water from the flower on my chest and it fires off in a random direction, soaks someone's brand new phone and ruins it. Sure, the person can just leave, the clown show is to entertain people and it does, people find it hilarious that my act has ruined this dude's brand new phone. Does that mean I didn't fuck up because my act fulfilled its purpose? Of course not. I think you've misunderstood the topic here, nobody is talking about being afraid of being exposed to ideas that they disagree with. That has literally absolutely nothing to do with triggers. The point of asking for trigger warnings is precisely so discussion can occur without hurting someone and interrupting the discussion by having them have a panic attack or episode, or have to leave the room in the middle. Basically, anyone who isn't on board with trigger warnings is essentially scared of new ideas and perspectives being put forward, which obviously has no place in a university. But nobody is asking the world to come to a halt, what are you talking about? The main themes in this thread are: 1) triggers warnings can be useful, so if you're about to give a lecture that involves graphic discussion of rape, maybe start it by saying: "Just so you know, some discussion of rape will be occurring today", and 2) if someone is hurt by your actions, that's a shitty thing even if you didn't intend to hurt them. Neither of those things require a "halt" to society. The first takes 2 seconds in order to allow a full and open discussion where nobody gets hurt and everyone gets exposed to new ideas and new perspectives, and the second requires you to do absolutely nothing different since it's just a description of a causal relationship (if you do X and X hurts someone without your intention, it is called a "fuck up").That someone was hurt by what you said does not automatically mean that you "fucked up". Individual feelings don't magically override every other thing in the world.
If you're in a comedy club and a comedian makes a joke that upsets you, well, you're in a comedy club. It's not about you being upset, it's about the comedian making people laugh. If you're so upset that you can't enjoy it you should leave. It's unfortunate that you're upset but it doesn't mean the comedian made a mistake.
If you're in a classroom and someone says something you disagree with and it makes you uncomfortable, that doesn't mean they fucked up either! You're taking part in an environment that promotes the exchange of ideas for educational purposes. If you're afraid of being exposed to ideas that you may disagree with, it's not the place for you.
That some of us may be fragile does not mean that the rest of the world must come to a halt. It means that you'd better go buy yourself a nice padded suit, or hang out in a padded room, or buck up.
I'm an artist. I paint a picture of Jesus taking a shit and hang it up in the Met. Christians everywhere are pissed. Some people are so offended by the painting it makes them cry. Did I fuck up? Nope. Art that offends only "fucks up" if its goal is to be inoffensive. Personally, I'm not all that captivated by art that first and foremost attempts to be inoffensive. I don't think comedy is as funny when you tiptoe around every single person in the room's personal experiences. I've had traumatic experiences, my life isn't what it could be because of them, and it's comedy that keeps me going. Comedy makes every day worth living. It's probably the primary reason I never bothered to kill myself. That's not just the case for me, that's the case for a lot of comedy fans, and moreover, a massive proportion of comedians. Comedy and depression overlap like bacon and cheese. So no, I don't think comedians fuck up if while bringing joy to a massive number of people who really need it they accidentally offend people who should, being as sensitive as they are, really know better than to hang out in comedy clubs. If you go to a comedy club with any sort of chip on your shoulder, you should expect to be offended. That's not what comedy clubs are for, they're for letting go and laughing. The point of asking for trigger warnings is precisely so discussion can occur without hurting someone and interrupting the discussion by having them have a panic attack or episode, or have to leave the room in the middle. Basically, anyone who isn't on board with trigger warnings is essentially scared of new ideas and perspectives being put forward, which obviously has no place in a university. Which is frankly ridiculous. Adults need to be able to deal with a world that isn't tailored to their specifications, because the world is not. Treating college students like children is not preparing people for the world. And as far as PTSD goes, isolating people from difficult stimuli is the exact opposite of what psychologists recommend. Psychologists push for gradual exposure to triggering stimuli in order to lessen the impact, not avoidance. Beside which, do you have any idea how diverse triggering stimuli for PTSD are? It can be pretty much anything. We can't ask the world to tiptoe around us. I mean, sure, maybe our friends and our family should know what makes us tick so they can make us comfortable, but unless you walk around with a sign hanging from your neck that explains all your triggers it's not realistic to expect people to even know what they are let alone act on them. What specific triggers do you think should be catered to and what should be done to cater to them? Sure they are. If the primary thing we're focusing on, the thing that determines whether or not we fucked up, is whether nor not someone was offended that's the end of art. All of it. Gone. Down the tubes. For what? So the most sensitive person in the room who wants us to tiptoe around them doesn't leave? Why? I mean Jerry Seinfeld, by all indications the world's most successful clean comedian, one of the cleanest big guys out there, won't play college campuses because he says they're too PC. This decision that people's feelings of being offended or being disturbed by something that challenges them or brings up something emotional for them are more important than the art that evokes those feelings is not something I'll ever agree with. The religious right has been pulling this stuff for my entire life and long before that and it never leads to anything positive. The reasoning might be different, but it boils down to the same thing: make art tailored to people who are public about taking offense. It's been done and it creates bland crap.I think you've misunderstood the topic here, nobody is talking about being afraid of being exposed to ideas that they disagree with. That has literally absolutely nothing to do with triggers.
But nobody is asking the world to come to a halt, what are you talking about?