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comment by kleinbl00
kleinbl00  ·  978 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Why everyone hates the GOP's new healthcare plan

And my freelance plan that we'd grandfathered into because of changes in state law was legally terminated by our insurance company so that they could charge us $800 a month instead of $300 and we didn't buy on the market either. But listen:

My contractor with the three kids by two different women and the dual DUI convictions and the missing teeth has health insurance and he didn't. And so does his brother, and so does his uncle, and so does his boss. We can sling anecdata at each other all day but the bottom line is, your argument - "it seems like there are some problems that we've been talking about as if they're true, when they aren't" - is tenuous. It's a bummer for you that the ACA killed your sweetheart insurance but you found other means. It's a bummer for me that the ACA killed my sweetheart insurance but I found other means. But I run out of fingers before I finish counting the friends and acquaintances of mine who had healthcare after 2013 that didn't before and that's a success.




user-inactivated  ·  978 days ago  ·  link  ·  

You're so condescending that it's hard to listen to you. But listen:

People having healthcare is good. My argument is that the repeal of the ACA is being resisted under the argument that 20 million people are losing healthcare. I am arguing that this is false, and should not be repeated as it is not a true consideration of the facts, regardless of the margin of error in any of our surveys and research. I say it's 3-7 mil, you say 9. It's not 20.

The measure of the success of the bill should not be a nominal counting of people with insurance, but the cost and benefit of that plan. The ACA has raised costs dramatically while making improvements that could have been made by expanding medicare, and creating a high-risk pool that would serve to cover those with pre-existing conditions at a subsidized rate without creating a government mandate to support insurance companies.

The ACA and this replacement could have been written by the insurance companies themselves. They have no incentives to improve, cut costs, negotiate strongly, or benefit the customer, you're going to buy it anyway because of the way insurance laws prevent competition, and if you don't, you're going to pay a lot more when you need it.

Hell, Blue Cross is a non-profit and somehow made 100 million last year while bemoaning the terrible losses that they took on ACA customers.

kleinbl00  ·  978 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Did you know that 2.5 millilon employees work in healthcare insurance and that a single payer option would probably reduce that in a huge way, creating a massive group of unemployed people?

If you've been following Pubski at all for the past three years, you're aware that I've been building a healthcare facility with my wife, the doctor. You probably didn't know that she used to help design benefits plans, or that a good friend of ours was the benefits coordinator for Cedars Sinai, or that I spent two years designing implantable medical devices. I didn't bring it up because it isn't relevant to your argument ("20 million people aren't about to lose covereage.")

I unmuted you because I thought you could be civil. Prove me right on this one, not wrong.

To that argument - that 20 million people aren't about to lose coverage - you have one study. That study is an outlier, and two years old. I pointed out that Medicare's own page says something else; you observed that two years ago, not everybody paid. So you deep-dived on that number and now here you are saying 3 to 7 doesn't equal 20, and you're right. But that number also doesn't count the state exchanges:

My broader point is that your argument is one that I haven't seen before - that the number of uninsured is controversial. You branched it out, I branched it out. I'm trying to be civil here.

The argument you made is unsupported. It doesn't mean you have other points - it doesn't even mean I disagree with those other points. It means that one aspect of your argument is one I don't think you made.

user-inactivated  ·  978 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I'm definitely not the first one to ask the question. This article is a pretty good explanation of the problem. And there's no great answer right now. There are too many variables to credit the ACA with everyone insured now that wasn't then in any estimate.

I like my source, which you dismiss, simply because it doesn't come from the Obama Administration which wrote, supported, and had to defend the Affordable Care Act. They also had a history of greatly over estimating the amount of additonal insured going back to 2011 when they said ACA would cover 32 million people.

The source I chose comes from Goldman Sachs who stake their company's financial well-being on being objective and honest. And they certinaly have a bias, but when you combine that bias with the administration's is where we have to be subjective.

I do find your tone to be condescending, and I don't like being spoken to like that. Maybe it's the tone of the internet, and you don't mean to do it, but you come off as very know-it-all. You basically told me to behave the way you like when you threatened to block/mute me again. If you feel like you need to block me beacuse I'm the type to address that directly, that's certainly your right.

snoodog  ·  977 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    I do find your tone to be condescending, and I don't like being spoken to like that. Maybe it's the tone of the internet, and you don't mean to do it, but you come off as very know-it-all. You basically told me to behave the way you like when you threatened to block/mute me again. If you feel like you need to block me beacuse I'm the type to address that directly, that's certainly your right.

That's just the way he always acts. Any sources that contradict his are immediately dismissed and if he can't come up with counter sources he will just hit you with anecdotal evidence that you can't address. Somewhere in the middle there will be a threat of muting and usually the last post or 2 are thinly veiled personal attacks.

The guy has an encyclopedia worth of knowledge so it's interesting to read his posts but I've found that it's not worth the emotional effort to engage with him since the discussion always gets uncivil.

kleinbl00  ·  978 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Sweet merciful jesus, dude, leave the healthcare bullshit aside for a minute. I'm trying to be polite to you. Why don't you try the same for me?