Literally nowhere have I made the statement that self defense is wrong. In fact, in many instances, it's the right thing to do. This statement . . . Is me admitting to the point that there are moral rights and wrongs to self defense and that they are numerous and worth discussing. However, you have readily illustrated, through this conversation and conversations in the past that you want to assume my arguments, make me defend positions I have not taken, and talk in circles without ever desiring to make any progress. Which means you want to argue instead of converse and not approach any dialog with a sense of good will. So we will not be having that conversation or any other.The morality behind those concepts can be discussed to the point where we'd fill a book.