a thoughtful web.
Good ideas and conversation. No ads, no tracking.   Login or Take a Tour!
comment by Devac
Devac  ·  2707 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Why I Like Doctor Strange

Wow. I never got into superhero genre because I have apparently only found the complete garbage so far. For instance, I will take any scene with Venture Bros' Professor Impossible over anything I've read so far about Fantastic Four. You make it sound like I have missed out on some amazing characters and stories. Very eloquently to boot!

Would you mind me requesting some guidance regarding proper superheroes? Ones that after stripping their powers wouldn't be blander than refrigerated mashed potatoes? So far you have convinced me to go to the cinema to watch something, and that didn't happen in at least a year.





rob05c  ·  2707 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    So far you have convinced me to go to the cinema to watch something

Well, no promises. I haven't seen it yet. But IMO Benedict Cumberbatch is a good actor, so that should help.

I'd agree, the Fantastic Four are one of Marvel's weaker groups. That said, Marvel characters tend to be more interesting than DC.

    guidance regarding proper superheroes

Hm. I'm anxious to recommend, when I have no idea how much what you find interesting lines up with what I do. Hollywood in general is terribly lacking in creativity, and there aren't many indie superhero films, and certainly none for Marvel or DC. But I'll give it a shot.

I thought the new Ant Man movie was really good. I went in expecting it to be mediocre, and it was fantastic. Especially if you like millenial snarky dialogue. I don't know anything about the Ant Man comics, though. In the movie, the character development wasn't off-the-charts, but there was a good bit of redemptiveness. It was especially good if you like the type of science fiction that describes how things work (like The Martian). They spent some time going over how all the Ant Man technology worked, both the shrinking and the controlling of ants, which I enjoyed. If you like that kind of thing.

As my Superman rant mentions, Justice League Batman is good, if you like that kind of explaining applied to tactics. There haven't been any good Justice League live-action movies, though there are a few decent animated ones. Justice League: Crisis on Two Earths and Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox.

I don't know which movies you've seen... I like Iron Man, as I said, for his arrogance combined with his mechanical genius (I'm an engineer). It makes him an interesting anti-hero. And Robert Downey Jr does an excellent job portraying that character.

In Guardians of the Galaxy, Chris Pratt also does a great job portraying the goofy-but-virtuous Star Lord. It isn't really true to the comic character, but if you're looking for movies, it's a good character in itself. The other characters in Guardians are relatively deep as well. Rocket Raccoon has a fantastic backstory which they only skim the surface of, and which significantly shapes his character (which the movie does portray well). I'm hoping we'll see more of it in Guardians 2 next year. Likewise, Star Lord has a lot of backstory yet to be covered, that Guardians 1 did a good job introducing.

Green Lantern is one of my favorite DC characters; but don't see the live-action movie. It's terrible. If you really want a movie to redeem DC, there are several animated Green Lantern films which are okay, one with the Green Lantern's backstory, and one about non-human Green Lanterns and the history of that universe (Green Lantern: Emerald Knights).

The Daredevil character is good too, but the 2003 movie only did a mediocre job presenting him. I've heard the new TV series is good, but I haven't seen it, so I can't say.

Mystery Men is good. It's a 1999 indie superhero comedy, about a team of misfits with janky powers. I found it funny enough, as well as doing a good job realising the struggles of misfits and nerds, and how they grow, learn from each other, learn to get along, etc. As a nerd myself, I found it relatable.

If you're open to graphic novels, I highly recommend Superman: Red Son. It's an alternate universe where Superman's baby spaceship lands in the USSR instead of the US. It's a great "what if", where Superman's innate goodness is combined with Communist upbringing. It's a fascinating though experiment, and does a great job redeeming an otherwise dreadful franchise.

On the subject of graphic novels: Neil Gaiman's Sandman is also phenomenal (as are the offshoot novellas about Death). Sandman takes place in the Marvel universe, but the Marvel superheroes have almost no part in it. It's a massive exploration of the life and psyche of Dream, one of the foundational deities of that universe. Dream's sister Death is another foundational-deity, and almost as interesting as the main character.

You may have noticed a trend: DC animated movies tend to be much better than their live action ones. Marvel are reversed; I can't think of a single animated Marvel movie worth watching. The 2007 Doctor Strange possibly being the exception.

There's also a radical difference in screen and comic depth. Most comic books have exponentially more depth than films. For example, the many Wolverine movies show off just how much depth there is to his character, but they're only mediocre at presenting it. Marvel has poured an incredible amount of depth and history into that one character. Actually, all the X-Men have deep backgrounds and characters, but there are so many, the films don't have time to go into any of them.

I like superheroes for the same reason I like any mythology: they personify our humanity. Everything that makes us human, is personified and clarified into singular characters: hopes and fears and dreams; virtues, and vices, selfishness and charity. Everything that makes us human, distilled and bottled and written down, for ourselves and others, to read and understand, and hopefully use and learn from, to live better.

user-inactivated  ·  2706 days ago  ·  link  ·  

The Timmverse DC is amazing. If I were to recommend any DC to anyone, it would be that. I'd also recommend Astro City as far as cape comics are concerned. They're very well written and touch on various themes.

user-inactivated  ·  2706 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Sandman takes place in the Marvel universe, but the Marvel superheroes have almost no part in it.

Sandman is DC. Martian Manhunter, Doctor Destiny, Scarecrow and Batman all appear: the former three - right in the first few issues, the latter - during Dream's funeral. Bast is also the DC's version of the goddess. So on. Sandman was set up to be within the DC continuity, but the idea was slowly abandoned later, while connections still remain.

    I've heard the new TV series is good, but I haven't seen it, so I can't say.

It's very good. If the 2003 film is a 2 or 3, the series is 7 or 8. Characters are all fleshed out and well done, production quality is very high and the story is quite interesting.

rob05c  ·  2706 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Ah, you're right. They appear so infrequently, I forgot.

Oh yeah, there's a Russian superhero film coming out next year

I'm hopeful it'll be more creative than Hollywood. It could hardly be less.

user-inactivated  ·  2706 days ago  ·  link  ·  

...oh. my. god.

I haven't heard about it before you've mentioned it. Jesus. I was hopeful when it came to the part where the Soviet Union has collapsed so the "superheroes" had to blend in as ordinary people. "That's an interesting twist. So, the Union is no longer able to sustain their cover and/or give them job, so they have to flee from and to their own country and settle down". This is what happens with spies, after all. But then, "But the Evil once again will come out of the shadow"...

Hoo. Spooky. /s

That being said, we're moving forward as a superhero-embracing culture. It is as if the first X-Men film was just introduced and people need to understand what's going on and why's one guy capable of slicing up cars. Russia doesn't have the same history with superheroics as the US does, so there won't be a leap of quality akin to the MCU's because there's no one to guide it yet. I wonder what comes out of it.

I doubt that a film that shows a roaring bear will be very creative, though.

Either way, thanks for linking the trailers to me.

Devac  ·  2706 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Much appreciated, thank you! Seems like I'm going to have material for all slow weekends for the rest of the semester, if not more. :D

    I have no idea how much what you find interesting lines up with what I do.

I'll put it like that: judging by your analysis and points that you made about Doctor Strange and earlier ones about Batman and Superman, I think that the cliche "we are not so different, you and I" is in order. ;)

If there is anything that I feel could help is that I hate certain arse-pull moments resulting from sloppy writing. I don't mind, for example, a brilliant engineer doing decades worth of work in a week, provided that said scientist was established as that good and resourceful. Which is point for point Iron Man from what I've read on Wikipedia. If Iron Man would suddenly be able to out-diagnose Dr House, that's where I would stand up and leave. Or let's say that Superman would also had some contrived super-brain that would let him memorise and understand everything amassed in Library of Congress in nanoseconds. That's would require going beyond words like 'omniloathsome'.

    I don't know which movies you've seen

Pretty much none, so you making the above selection and synopsis will undoubtedly make bunch of evenings really fun for me. Most of them came out when I was still in high school, a pretty hectic time for me all things considered. I barely had any time between piano practice, schoolwork, science Olympiads, basketball training etc. In that regard I was fitting the trope of über-achieving kid a bit too much for my liking. That said, while I love my parents and constantly look-up to them, this is a major reason why I'm living in the dorm. ;)

user-inactivated  ·  2702 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I don't see it mentioned anywhere else but watch the Marvel stuff on Netflix. I will praise Luke Cage on every hill I end up on top of.

I might make a post soon actually, this website is (COMPLETELY UNSURPRISINGLY) lacking in Luke Cage praise.

Devac  ·  2701 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Thanks! I'll add it to the list.

    I might make a post soon actually,

Already looking forward to it. :D

    COMPLETELY UNSURPRISINGLY

What?