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comment by kleinbl00
kleinbl00  ·  712 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Kellyanne Conway cites non-existent 'massacre' defending ban

Look closely, though - it's easy to say "this entire Administration is based on deceit" but you misjudge the dynamics at play when you look for sweeping simplifications like that.

There's a fact at the core of things: Two men, who were legally in the United States from Iraq, were arrested in Bowling Green and convicted of terrorism. This was due to functional and involved leg-work by the FBI and it's a happy ending.

If you're a fan of Obama, Our Administration caught the bad guy without stepping on anyone's civil rights therefore the system works. If you're a detractor of Obama, Their Administration let terrorists into the United States to blow things up and thank God the FBI caught them before they could do anything heinous!

So from a liberal perspective, the system works, why are we talking about this, the Bowling Green Massacre is a ridiculous Trumpkin falsehood. From a Trumpkin perspective, "Bowling Green Massacre" and "Bowling Green Could-Have-Been-A-Massacre" are exactly the same thing surely you liberals have better things to protest right now.

THAT is the problem we're dealing with: "could have been a massacre" and "actually was a massacre" are given rhetorical equivalency by this administration and when you point out the difference you are LITERALLY TRYING TO GET WORKING CLASS AMERICANS KILLED.

NYT had a piece a few days back about Trump voters that are all about the Muslim ban.

    - “I was like, ‘Oh, my God.’ I was so happy,” said Mr. Oliva, 32. He is gay and said he was deeply affected by the shooting at Pulse, a gay nightclub in Orlando, Fla., by an American of Afghan descent. “That one really got to me. That could have been me.”

    - “I don’t begrudge my grandma who never met a Muslim in her life, but all she sees on TV are Muslims blowing things up,” said Mr. Bower, 35, who grew up in rural Idaho. “It is not irrational that people are worried.”

    - For Louis Murray, 52, a life insurance salesman in Boston, Mr. Trump’s order left him “ecstatic.” He recalled the Tsarnaev brothers, who were from a Muslim-majority part of the former Soviet Union, entered the United States on tourist visas and then applied for asylum. “They said they were in fear of their lives,” he said, “but yet they went back there for terrorist training. And they repaid our kindness of refugee status with a triple murder and a pressure-cooker bomb put on the Boston Marathon finish line. I can remember our whole city and region being on lockdown, and it was sheer terror.”

    - Mr. Broesch and his wife, Lynn, strongly support the immigration order. Mrs. Broesch said she had been wary of Muslims since Sept. 11, but had a new surge of worry after the knife attack by a Somali-American last year in a mall in Minnesota, where her son and his family live.

    - “Every story about a Muslim immigrant is that they are as American as apple pie,” he said. “But I’m sorry, Islam is no friend of L.G.B.T. people. When Islam meets gay people in Somalia or wherever, they get thrown off the roof. And you expect them to be different when they move here? You can’t expect people to absorb our values.”

These are people who don't give the first fuck that the actions taken by trump address their specific concerns one little bit. Because their statements, stripped of prevarication, are

- I'm scared of all muslims

- I'm scared of all muslims

- I'm scared of all muslims

- I'm scared of all muslims

- I'm scared of all muslims

- I'm scared of all muslims.

And they don't give a fuck that it's racist to be scared of all muslims. And they don't give a fuck that

    His detractors argue that his actions are not borne out by facts. Since Sept. 11, 2001, no one has been killed in a terrorist attack in the United States by an immigrant — or the son or daughter of an immigrant — from any of the seven countries in the 90-day visa ban. A vast majority of killings over all happen at the hands of native-born Americans. Some recent attacks in which the Islamic State was invoked were carried out by Muslims born in the United States.

In fact,

    “The liberal media spent all their time and effort bashing him, laughing at him, saying he wasn’t fit,” said Don Broesch, a retired accountant from Germantown, Wis., who said it seemed as if every single story about Mr. Trump during the campaign was negative. “When there’s an underdog out there, and they are totally criticizing him, all it does is drum up support for him. It makes me like him even more. I love it when they bash him because it tells me he’s doing the right thing.”

So to the people who voted for Trump, "Bowling Green arrests" and "Bowling Green Massacre" are rhetorically equivalent because all muslims are bad, all liberals are enablers, and if it weren't for Donald Trump, surely there would have been a massacre (in 2011).

It isn't deceit. It's willful ignorance. It's the kind of thing that makes you set up a State's Rights test case for the Supreme Court that will curtail executive power before you can even approve a Supreme Court Justice. It's the belief that if you feel it strongly enough it doesn't matter what it actually is.

"The facts have a well-known liberal bias."

- Rob Corddry




user-inactivated  ·  712 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    There's a fact at the core of things: Two men, who were legally in the United States from Iraq, were arrested in Bowling Green and convicted of terrorism. This was due to functional and involved leg-work by the FBI and it's a happy ending.

Serious question, isn't this one of those instances where the FBI coerced people who originally didn't have the means or the desires to commit a crime so they could pad their record? If so, that kind of colors the whole situation a bit differently.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

kleinbl00  ·  712 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Serious question, isn't this one of those instances where the FBI coerced people who originally didn't have the means or the desires to commit a crime so they could pad their record?

Absolutely positively not. You're thinking of the Liberty City Seven.

    An intelligence tip initially led the FBI to Waad Ramadan Alwan, 32, in 2009. The Iraqi had claimed to be a refugee who faced persecution back home -- a story that shattered when the FBI found his fingerprints on a cordless phone base that U.S. soldiers dug up in a gravel pile south of Bayji, Iraq on Sept. 1, 2005. The phone base had been wired to unexploded bombs buried in a nearby road.

    An ABC News investigation of the flawed U.S. refugee screening system, which was overhauled two years ago, showed that Alwan was mistakenly allowed into the U.S. and resettled in the leafy southern town of Bowling Green, Kentucky, a city of 60,000 which is home to Western Kentucky University and near the Army's Fort Knox and Fort Campbell. Alwan and another Iraqi refugee, Mohanad Shareef Hammadi, 26, were resettled in Bowling Green even though both had been detained during the war by Iraqi authorities, according to federal prosecutors.

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/al-qaeda-kentucky-us-dozens-terrorists-country-refugees/story?id=20931131