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comment by Quatrarius

It's like living by the corner of a lake. Whenever somebody stirs up shit off the bottom, it all floats to you. That's all that this is. I'll believe that it's the end of reddit when I see it.





PathogenXD  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I've always had the idea that Reddit was a place where you could say anything, as long as it wasn't illegal. You might get downvoted to oblivion, but you could still say what you wanted to say. While the subreddit they banned was distasteful and cruel, it wasn't illegal.

When free speech is shuttered because people are offended by what they're hearing, it just seems wrong to me. In addition, because that subreddit existed, that sort of attitude was basically confined there. It was a very poor decision to ban it in my opinion.

Quatrarius  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

It wasn't banned for being distasteful. It was banned for harassment and brigading, things that were rampant within the subreddit. The attitude was very much not confined there. There's the myth of "fat admins getting their fee-fees hurt", but that's very much not true.

PathogenXD  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Why is it acceptable to ban subreddits in the name of harassment? Do you have examples of any brigading? Other subreddits brigade all the time, and it's not that big of a deal. SRS used to do it all the time, and their subreddit is just fine.

Quatrarius  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Why is it acceptable to ban subreddits in the name of harassment?

Because people don't like being followed around and insulted for long periods of time.

    Do you have examples of any brigading?

Posts surrounding fatness or fat people on other subreddits were upvoted to space.

    Other subreddits brigade too

Then there should be other action.

PathogenXD  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Without specific examples, I can't really have an opinion on whether or not the popularity of those posts were the result of brigading by any specific subreddit, or whether it was just due to regular upvotes. Usually bots will point out in the comments when a post has been linked to in another subreddit. Always happens for posts linked to by SRD and such.

If a user is following another user around and commenting on everything they do, the solution there is to ban a user, not a subreddit. Targeting a user for parody is something I believe should be allowed. For example, if someone wants to target President Bush and imply he's a sexual deviant of some sort, I believe that they should be allowed to. I don't believe they should be able to call his phone at all hours of the day and night to personally harass him, but in public places and in their own forums, they should be able to lampoon as much as they like.

KaliYugaz  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    If a user is following another user around and commenting on everything they do, the solution there is to ban a user, not a subreddit.

A good analogy is this: If there's a hole in your tire, you patch it up. But if there's always holes forming in your tire, you have to throw out the tire.

FatPeopleHate wasn't just offensive to some people, it was objectively out of control. First off, the core idea of Reddit is not absolute free speech, but the libertarian principle of absolute sovereignty over one's property, which in their case means the right of any community on the site to have absolute sovereignty over their own subreddit, free from interference by both the admins and by the other users.

FPH was constantly bullying people and brigading in other subs (GTAV, Fitness, loseit, even SuicideWatch at one point) and interfering with the culture and functioning of those communities. The problem was too big to solve by banning a few people. When they targeted the admins of imgur, with the encouragement of the mods no less, that was the last straw.

PathogenXD  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Once again, I'll need specific examples of brigading before I'll accept that. As far as the admins of imgur go, it looks like they were making fun of them on their own subreddit. As far as users going to other subreddits and expressing their opinion, that is their right. It's the right of others to downvote them if they want to or for mods to enforce subreddit or site-wide rules.

Look, to be honest, I'm not sure why you're supporting out-right censorship. Even if Reddit wasn't built around the principle of free speech, this is a huge violation of the sovereignty of subreddits. In the past, subreddits have fought against each other with brigades and hate, but they never completely dissolved unless they were illegal. I've seen moderation coups and admin sponsored civil war, but unless it was illegal, the subreddit itself was bound to stay.

KaliYugaz  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Once again, I'll need specific examples of brigading before I'll accept that.

It's on the CMV thread back at Reddit.

    Even if Reddit wasn't built around the principle of free speech, this is a huge violation of the sovereignty of subreddits.

Only if you believe that they did nothing wrong. Otherwise, it is an action taken in defense of the sovereignty of all the other subs on Reddit who get targeted by FPH brigades and nasty PMs.

NelsonzzWillie  ·  2243 days ago  ·  link  ·  

The issue is keeping people from /r/fatpeoplehate out of other subreddits. If those subs are there, so are the users.