a thoughtful web.
Good ideas and conversation. No ads, no tracking.   Login or Take a Tour!
comment by nowaypablo
nowaypablo  ·  3631 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: I’m making $21 an hour at McDonald’s. Why aren’t you?

Sigh Big Brother Ronald is smarter than to let mere citizens get away with a comfortable life at the expense of his profit.

To take it a step further I'm a bit wary that the guy seemed to be blaming the workers for not sticking it to the man. Is that woman with two kids making <$9/hr supposed to organize a union? Go on strike? Come on.





ixnar  ·  3631 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Yes, she is. Do you think the strikers during the Industrial Revolution had it easier?

nowaypablo  ·  3631 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Frankly yes, the responsibilities of today far outnumber those of centuries past. The physical suffering and hardship are obviously incomparable, but that doesnt mean she can't feel just as helpless. The workers who slept in mountains of waste in the Industrial Revolution had reason to be furious, a collective desire to fight back and have modicum of security in a circumstance where their lives and health were at direct physical risk. There is no collective tension to revolt building up in Brooklyn fueled by plague and rotting corpses in the streets. This is a muffled, silent torture where a bar of demand is set but a mere fraction of the resources necessary to reach that standard is available.

mk  ·  3631 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Frankly yes, the responsibilities of today far outnumber those of centuries past.

I'm curious why you would think so.

    This is a muffled, silent torture where a bar of demand is set but a mere fraction of the resources necessary to reach that standard is available.

And yet the discontent is there. From my reading of history, it's my impression that focus for such discontent can arise quickly, usually due to a few missteps of those in power coincident with a catalyst or rallying point for the oppressed. People seem powerless until they don't, and that change can happen very fast.

nowaypablo  ·  3631 days ago  ·  link  ·  

It was stupid to say that, I was trying to express that the immense physical suffering in the Ind. Revolution tipped an entire social class over the edge. Today's hardships, despite how numerous they are, do pale in comparison but if a particular injury is the worst pain we've ever felt or heard of, we will feel that it is the worst pain imaginable. That woman might feel hopelessness, guilt in regards to not being able to provide enough for her kids and the burden of crushing debt perhaps-- her eyes aren't being gnawed out by rats but for her, those pains are the worst pains imaginable and they are equally paralyzing, but not the same caliber of animalistic, physical threat to life that would prompt a fight-back instinct when the person feels that they have nothing left to lose.

    focus for such discontent can arise quickly, usually due to a few missteps of those in power coincident with a catalyst or rallying point for the oppressed. People seem powerless until they don't, and that change can happen very fast.

I just don't see any cataclysmic changes/triggers happening right now, I didn't say she cant' "rise up" with the support of just tens of thousands just like her, what I'm saying is she cannot be expected to and be put at fault by the guy making $21/hr like she's stupid. We can't all be Gandhi, and may not have the willpower even if we are conscious of our own oppression.

ixnar  ·  3631 days ago  ·  link  ·  

You only have as many responsibilities as you take on, and the bar of demand is entirely in your head. It's the old trap of needing to compare yourself to others to be happy. Make the workers realize this so they may free themselves, and happiness might follow. Plus we might get rid of this pesky need to consume, which is the cause of wage slavery in the first place

nowaypablo  ·  3631 days ago  ·  link  ·  

You are right about it being in your head, and I ended up trying to justify my point by comparable two time periods which I still think are completely incomparable..

My issue is that you say it so simply it is almost patronizing, I urge you to imagine yourself in the position of that woman.

    Make the workers realize this so they may free themselves, and happiness might follow. Plus we might get rid of this pesky need to consume, which is the cause of wage slavery in the first place

That sounds like a great objective, but how exactly are we supposed to get there?

ixnar  ·  3627 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I don't know. Art? Implant the idea that things aren't right. Or just engage in some left-y local political movement

And you're right, I was being a bit patronizing. Sorry about that