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Above all else, I'd like to note the cowardly actions of some hubskiers. Of fucking course rape culture is real. Denying that is denying the straight facts of our society, but instead of actively making their (albeit probably misguided) thoughts and opinions on the article and subject known, opted to anonymously change the user tag on this to 'no', which added nothing and changed no one's opinions, but made us aware of some snotty young person's dissent and attempts to discredit this idea without even acknowledging the arguments. Keep that bullshit on reddit, please; here we discuss things.
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user-inactivated · 1694 days ago · link ·
DUDE I HAVE TO TELL YOU WHAT HAPPENED LAST NIGHT. There I was, at a party with some friends at college because I totally go to college and it's awesome. We were drinking the alcohol and all that because we are totally old enough to do it we were doing shots and drinking brewskis from keg my friend bought with his real ID card. Well, I am telling joke after hilarious joke and all the females there are looking at me. I'm pretty alpha so I start sizing them up. All except one. She was your typical feminist. She had dread locks and kept talking about the patriarchy all the time. Sooooo annoying. We kind of just blew her off because we are so super alpha and you meet a lot of people at college so. NEWAY she's going off about it and I was pretty sick about it so I walked up to her and said "Let me ask you something. If you feminists have it all figured out, why do you keep friend zoning guys???" Well, instead of arguing back, she just slaps me. We were all stunned! We didn't know what to do! So I looked at my friend and then I slapped her back! She held her face for a second, but then she looked at me and said "Thanks for treating me like an equal." Everyone applauded and the rest of the night was a blast and we drank a lot of alcohol together but we had college homeroom in the morning so not too late. Since I don't want to be all snark: It blows my mind that someone can "disagree with feminist ideologies". What the hell does that even mean. "Equality is not something I agree with!"?
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People frequently have this idea of rights as a zero sum game. "If I give them rights, I'll lose some of mine!!" Of course it's not true. Worse, though, is this idea of 'straw-feminists': bra-burning, second-wave, man-hating 'oversensitive' types that want men to apologize for being men. These people don't really exist, and if they do, they're a minority, and their ideas are not part of what feminism is. The internet loves to spread fake stories about them in the same way they spread fake stories about black girls named "La-a" and shit. It's a discussion of philosophy and things like 'patriarchy' and 'rape culture' are concepts of subconscious, systemic issues; no one believes there's a conspiracy of men talking and keeping women down, that's ridiculous, but people can't see things in a long-view or a non-literalist way. It's the same thing when we talk about problems with the institutional form of 'men', and they see it as 'all men' and take offense (and then, of course, that's the issue of making a problem about violence and oppression about how they feel when you say those things, because all attention has to be on men at all times.) Feminism is easy: do you believe in equality? Feminist. Better: Do you want to be a good, not 'white, privileged feminist'? Do you believe in all equality, for women of color as well? Intersectional feminism. It's fucking important.
user-inactivated · 1694 days ago · link ·
The main reason for that, is because I think that feminists aren't actually fighting for equality. Otherwise, they would address issues that make them more priviliged than men, so that they would become truly equal to men. For example, men are more likely to be incarcerated for longer periods of time then women, even when they committed the exact same crime. I could give you another example about domestic violence in the UK. There, 40% of domestic violence victims are men, but at the same time, the spots available for men in domestic abuse shelters is barely 2%: 80 spots for men, 4000 for women. In short, as long as both female and male privilege exist, true equality will not be attainable.
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Yes! Yes there are issues! And yes they're addressed by feminism! Patriarchy affects men just as much as women. Why do you think there's always the image of men being strong, emotionless, quick to violence? Because that's what our society has deemed 'masculine', a trait assigned to them just like 'feminine' traits are assigned to women. The courts give kids to women? Because women are supposed to be the caretakers in our society's eyes. Domestic case? Well it has to be men, because our society's perception is men are strong, women are weak. If you look up any feminist rhetoric, these are issues frequently addressed and brought up. These things are important, but the people who spout 'feminists don't care about equality' have never investigated feminism, they only know what they've been told about feminism from people who hate it.
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user-inactivated · 1694 days ago · link ·
I completely agree with your first paragraph. However, it seems that the most vocal, and also negative feminists (perhaps a minority), attract more attention than the ones who address the issues you mentioned above. At the same time, you can find plenty of stories online about men who think that women shouldn't be allowed to vote or that they belong in the kitchen. We can only progress by making both of these groups aware that their hate-mongering is only pitting different groups of people against each other and is not leading us anywhere.
user-inactivated · 1694 days ago · link ·
All I get from this is that both men and women have problems. And I certainly agree with that. And I can also agree that the issues men have should be solved, too. But I don't think being okay with feminism and solving those problems for men are mutually exclusive.
You've been doing it on a lot more than the feminism posts. If you want to have a discussion, have a discussion. One line snarky remarks are not accepted on this website, as I and many others have made multiple posts about prior. You will be muted, ignored, and will not be engaged if you post these sorts of things. You can wave a flag saying "NOT ALL MEN!" for all we care as long as you state you case and are respectfully stating it. You will then be torn apart with rebuttals, of course, but at least you're contributing to the site in some way. Edit: Turns out I'm wrong. Everything you have posted is one line complaints about feminism.
ButterflyEffect · 1753 days ago · link ·
I've noticed that tag on quite a few posts, and am always left wondering who uses it. Clearly there's an opinion behind it, and I wish it was shared as opposed to tagged without context....but instead of actively making their (albeit probably misguided) thoughts and opinions on the article and subject known, opted to anonymously change the user tag on this to 'no', which added nothing and changed no one's opinions...
user-inactivated · 1752 days ago · link ·
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It's not a 'better than/worse than' situation, it's a simple matter of constructive versus non constructive dialogue. Saying "there are issues with this but it would be circular to point them out" is like "well, you're wrong because, c'mon, I can't even say why." It doesn't add anything and adds no perspective except "WRONG I'M BETTER!" But the bigger problem is your doing this on a feminist article; a social justice article, and that kind of behavior is common in systems of oppression. It's a microcosm for attempts to silence dissent. Instead of granting the oppressed or downtrodden a voice, the majority simply refuses to acknowledge them and their opinions or open a discussion on it, but still make sure it's known to those trying to make better that you do not value them and are looming, facelessly and anonymously. It's almost a threat, and it discourages other people to have their thoughts known. That's a big, big issue. Every perspective should be heard and sifted through, even if you don't agree with it. Every idea worth holding today was despised and silenced at one point or another. It's what's known as a microaggression, as it's not a big deal, small enough that getting called out for it can cause someone to ask what the big deal is, it was minor, but it's a matter of being a symbolic part of something larger. So please, if you disagree, you have every right to tell us why, just tell us why.
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user-inactivated · 1750 days ago · link ·
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