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comment by ooli
ooli  ·  1807 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Sci-Fi club no. 40: A Colder War Discussion

    If you launch a nuclear head on Cthulhu, he will come back 15 minutes later, and he will be radioactive

I read it on zebra2 account that the story addressed Fermi paradox. So far I never found Sci-fi addressing my favorite paradox. May be it is not an interesting fictional plot device , or I'm more illiterate than I want to admit.

I had some hard time getting through the beginning : I don't like 20 minutes into the future setting.

And having famous president (and Saddam!) making an appearance, dont help with immersion. At least, we dont see a "Megacomputer with more than 500 Mo of memory!" , that tend to appear in those settings written 20year ago.

My interest raised with the apparition of the alien (because everything is better with alien). It was original to have the Great filter being the inevitable use of alien weapon. But in the end, it's just Nuclear annihilation concept with Bigger sticks

I loved the use of alien world as an last ditch escape. Except it totally contradict the point of the great Filter being finding alien world, and using their tech, if we can fly there and start again.

The use of Cthulhu mythos Name without Lampshading it, sound uninspired, and is a bit off putting.

So, in the end, some Good ideas that dont go well together.. I mean Saddam launching WW3 and Cthulhu over america...





OftenBen  ·  1806 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    I loved the use of alien world as an last ditch escape. Except it totally contradict the point of the great Filter being finding alien world, and using their tech, if we can fly there and start again.

So, the 'shelter' they had set up on the alien world is really that, a shelter.

People can talk about starting a colony all they want, but it's not going to happen.

The world is dry, the air too thin, the sun too dim to really support the kind of high energy metabolism of Earth biology, even if you could make enough changes to the atmosphere.

XK-Masada isn't a new Earth, it's just the desert island where last lifeboat washed up.

ooli  ·  1804 days ago  ·  link  ·  

your lack of faith in human ingenuity is disturbing

OftenBen  ·  1804 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I can't suggest The Laundry Files enough if you enjoyed this piece.

Stross uses XK-Masada or something a lot like it in a later story.

There are eldritch reasons why it will never be a new Eden.

orbat  ·  1806 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    I had some hard time getting through the beginning : I don't like 20 minutes into the future setting.

    And having famous president (and Saddam!) making an appearance, dont help with immersion. At least, we dont see a "Megacomputer with more than 500 Mo of memory!" , that tend to appear in those settings written 20year ago.

The story's not based in the future, though: it's an alternate history version of the 60's – 80's, which is also why Saddam or "old man Ruhollah" et al make appearances. Why'd period-accurate politicians break your immersion?

ooli  ·  1806 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Because If a read sci-fi, and it talk about Kennedy, and Saddam, it doesn't quite feel like a fiction anymore... But as I said, I dont like all those alternate reality setting (or it's just the use of famous figure that despise me) nothing specific with these one, just personal taste

I like my sci-fi being out there. And I like my James Ellroy books set in the 60' joking about the Kennedy.. I'm a simple mind

zebra2  ·  1806 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I agree with the Cthulu thing totally.

Re: the paradox—I can think of a couple that handle it offhand. Fermi and Frost is one I mentioned previously. This one is really more of an alternate history story than sci-fi, but with a chilling sense of realism.

Another is The Crystal Spheres, which would be my personal pick for the worst work to win a Hugo. I would love to have a sci-fi club for this one just to rag on it. Every line reads like a Lyttle Lytton entry.

Other than that I think it mostly gets mentioned in passing rather than tackled as a main concept because it's difficult to work a narrative around, as you said.

ooli  ·  1806 days ago  ·  link  ·  

thanks for the links.

Crystal Spheres is not that bad. The overuse of portmanteau words get tiring real fast, but the premise (solar system encased in spere) is good. The resolution is a lack luster. At least it got point for giving an happy solution to the Fermi paradox. Unsatisfying happy ending, but at least it is not a gloom unavoidable Great Filter

kleinbl00  ·  1805 days ago  ·  link  ·  

The most interesting attempt to deal with The Fermi Paradox I know of is the Spin trilogy by Robert Charles Wilson. But if you don't like sci fi, you're not going to want to put three novels worth of effort into it.

ooli  ·  1804 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I love Sci-fi. Must be the only genre I like. Except.. beside Frank Herbert, I never found some good sci-fi.

Asimov is good, but with stupid character sometime.

And most of the other, from Dan Simmons to C. Clark , F. Leiber (the one who wrote the same story twice, in 2 trilogy) , Jack Vance, Van vogt (at least, this one is funny for his personal heel face turn ), they all lack constructed clever story.. and as I said, I dont like sci-fi close in the future, like all the cyberpunk sub-genre.

Ok Zelazny, get a pass. He is funny with real original setting.

Herbert> Zelazny> Asimov > Every one else > K.Dick

So thanks for the recommendation. I'll read the summary ....

Ok I just read it on wiki

Now, I remember!!

I read that Book. I should have remember It has the same title in french.

I loved the premise. and was disappointed by the solution. On the grip hand, at the time I read it (if I remember well, I took it in my small local library under the Sacré Coeur.. or my modern library in Strasbourg... or I should check in my bookcase if I bought it)... anyway , at that time, I had no idea of the Fermi paradox.

But imho, it is still a lackluster resolution, so I never read anything else from the guy. That's the problem: when I love the basic mystery, the author better deliver on the resolution, or I get real pissed.

Maybe the 2 others tome are better. Guess I'll never know

Devac  ·  1803 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Out of curiosity, have you read The Cyberiad by Lem? It's definitely a good example of humorous/funny sci-fi – even accounting for my Polish bias – and I have a hunch you'd also like it.

kleinbl00  ·  1804 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Which is interesting because I had a really hard time with Frank Herbert.

Spin is a better book than the next two but Spin doesn't really resolve the Fermi Paradox. The other two books do.

    That's the problem: when I love the basic mystery, the author better deliver on the resolution, or I get real pissed.

Right there with ya. That's probably why I hated Three Body Problem so much.