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comment by kleinbl00
kleinbl00  ·  220 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Young people who play video games have higher moral reasoning skills

I dunno, man. I read through to the study and it's murky AF. It's based on a 25-minute SurveyMonkey multiple-choice questionnaire in which they asked four questions about gaming:

    Questions included: favorite games (up to five), number of years playing video games, length of time per week playing video games and number of genres played. The following content variables were extracted from the favorite games listed: Playing Grand Theft Auto (GTA) (Rockstar, 1997/2015) and Call of Duty (COD) (Activision, 2005/2015), Violent, Mature, Moral narrative and Content Rating (mean ESRB and PEGI rating of favorite games; see Table A1, Appendix A).

And then 18 questions about morality, based on the 1992 version of Gibbs Sociomoral Stage Theory:

    This measure consisted of 19 questions regarding how the participant usually feels when playing a video game and a score is given to represent the level of engagement (Yes = 2 Maybe = 1 and No = 0). The maximum score on the measure is 38 α = 0.85 (Brockmyer et al., 2009).

That really boils down to 18 questions of "do you have empathy, 2 for yes, 1 for maybe, 0 for no":

    Participants’ responses for each question were categorized into a stage of development and moral type, A or B. The eleven questions are split by themes: questions 1 to 4 Contract and Truth; questions 5 and 6 Affiliation (related to helping family and friends); questions, 7 and 8 Life questions, 9 and 10 Property and Law and finally question 11, Legal Justice. There are four stages of development (1–4) with three transitional stages in between each stage. A response is scored by matching the response to the appropriate Criterion Justification (CJ). The CJ are responses grouped by moral concepts, such as; empathic role taking, intrapersonal approval and prosocial intentions and include sample responses listed below to assist matching; for example “you may become friends”

The authors will go as far as saying:

    Only the 17 year olds had mature morality into stage three. However, 18 year olds were slightly lower and classed as immature but this is likely to be an artifact of the small sample size.

But don't see a problem that

- Girls don't play Grand Theft Auto (their data)

- Girls have played for half as long as boys (their data)

- Girls play half as much as boys (their data)

Or this whopper of a table:

Yeah - if you play video games, you're at a mean global score of 2.55 on their 3 point scale. If you don't play video games, you're at a mean global scale of 2.44. But if you play video games, you're at 124/135 of their sample and if you don't you're at 9 of 135. Meanwhile, it's easier to assert from their data that boys are more moral than girls than it is to assert that video games make you more moral.

Buuuuut they knew better than to write that paper.

user-inactivated  ·  219 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Yea most of these studies are either very small or odd.

Taken from here

You and I have gone back and forth on this in the past, preaching to the choir. Crime in the west peaked in 1989-1990. Since then it has fallen in some cases 80%. even the most violent cities in the US are safer now than at any time in human history. Unless you are involved in the illegal drug trade, the odds of you being the victim of a violent crime are near statistical zero. Some 2/3 of all crime in the USA is in less than a dozen ZIP codes. One link The Freakonomics guys credit legal abortion, the environmentalists credit the EPA and Environmental movement of the 70's, the teacher's unions credit the rise of an educated public, we are having fewer kids and investing more into them, starvation and hunger are for the most parts gone, we are healthier thanks to vaccines and general health care, and so on and so on. If violent media was a cause of violent crime, it would show up in the stats. One mentally ill person, or one idiot wanting to copy GTA5 here and there does not mean video games, movies, comics, books etc 'cause' crime.

But fear sells, and most of us meat sacks have an intrinsic fear of violent crime. Anyone wanting to dig into the US crime statistics, can get a good start here and move on to the FBI stats here. Don't want to be a crime victim? Don't get involved in illegal drugs. Don't do meth and heroin. Don't get hooked on pills. Don't be homeless. Don't engage in sex work (prostitution, etc).

The old fucks remember growing up in crime infested shitholes... that were still statistically at least safer than our parents and grandparents hometowns when they were growing up. I've lived in poor areas were gunshots and homicides were weekly things. I now live in a town where the big crime news was three high school kids stealing trucks for joy rides. The homicide, as it is now called, was a homeowner shooting and killing a meth head breaking into his garage. That was.. 5-6 years ago now? Now the opioid and meth crisis is coming this way so I anticipate a rise in crime over the next 4-5 years, but this is an armed area full of rednecks wanting to shoot an intruder and most criminals are not that stupid so I doubt even that type of property crime will rise that much here.

kleinbl00  ·  219 days ago  ·  link  ·  

The Freakanomics guys have no leg to stand on, as with most of the things they claim. Neither do the teacher's unions. The environmentalists, though...

The Lead-Crime Hypothesis is unpopular with 'boomers because it makes the human race look terrible. We knew lead was a brain-damaging toxin in 200 BC. We knew tetraethyl lead was an environmental toxin before we ever put it in cars. And the damage it did is permanent: the people who got poisoned are permanently stupider and permanently have poorer impulse control.

Yet Capitalism found a way.

And they're the ones who got most of the stupid.

    The old fucks remember growing up in crime infested shitholes... that were still statistically at least safer than our parents and grandparents hometowns when they were growing up.

It wasn't, though, and that's a common misconception. Crime really did peak in the '90s, never to return. It's safer now than it was in the '70s.

user-inactivated  ·  219 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I think it was you and I about five-six years ago going back and forth on the Freakonomics guys that made me dig into them and re-evaluate my stance on them. Yea, that abortion methodology is suspect, but I added it into the mix as the root causes of the massive drop in crime over the last 20-30 years is still not well understood.

Crime in general is lower today than at any time we have reliable records, even lower than the 1930's and the Prohibition Era. Yet people think we are in the middle of a murder and rape epidemic. Most of us have a higher chance at being in multiple car accidents than in a single violent crime.

    And the damage it did is permanent: the people who got poisoned are permanently stupider and permanently have poorer impulse control.

Holy shit you just figured out why Boomers cannot handle social media. Never made that connection before but damn if that does not explain a ton of garbage I see from the fucknut brigade online.

kleinbl00  ·  219 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Weren't me.