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comment by thenewgreen
thenewgreen  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Pubski: January 4, 2017

Perhaps you can paint the picture better for me, because I don't really understand how he was hitting on you by asking if someone was your dad? That seems like an odd way to try to win the affection of someone you find attractive. But then, I'm old and have been out of the "game" a long time. I definitely don't see where there is a potential lawsuit. What am I missing?

Honest question, what if this troll with his cheekfat were actually a really attractive and articulate man/woman that were more to your liking, would them asking if the person you were with was your father still disturb you as much?

Again, this is likely a case of me not getting it cause I've never had to experience it. I'm not ever hit on and I never do the hitting either. -strange term. "Hit on," -doesn't sound very appealing, does it?

Regardless of my lack of understanding, I'm sorry to hear you had a crappy experience at Goodwill. They seem to be an organization dedicated to supporting the underprivileged and families with special needs. Bummer they hired someone that made you feel that way.





_refugee_  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

So, he was trying to determine my relationship to my brother.

Can I ask you, if you were interacting with a guy and a girl you'd just met, what are the circumstances in which you'd want to know what their relationship was? You'd want to know if you wanted to know if the girl was single or not. You'd want to know if that guy was her boyfriend because you wouldn't want to try to hit on someone in front of their boyfriend. And let's drill down even more and get real specific: when would you ask the girl what her relationship to the dude was? Why? Cuz he didn't turn to both of us and go, "Oh, you related?" That's ok, if awkward, small talk. But he ignored my brother, and he asked me.

If I were alone, it'd be "Hey, you got a boyfriend?" But because I was with a guy, who might be that boyfriend, (who might get an attitude if he thought GW was hitting on his girl in front of him, or whatever) the inquiry went a little subtler.

Maybe you're saying, "If you look really similar, I could see a stranger asking if you were related!"

Yes, but then why did he say "Dad" instead of "brother", which would be the obvious choice if he thinks we're related due to how close in age we are?

I'm just throwing this out there, how many times has a stranger asked you how you know the person you're hanging out with as an attempt to start a conversation? I'm willing to bet the answer is "never."

It's certainly a fucking awkward choice for small talk, though I guess if you want you can suggest that the guy simply is socially awkward (after all, we'll never know) and his remark was totally innocent, if completely weird. Then why wouldn't he ask both people a question both could answer? If we're going back to "he's fucking awkward," that's fine, again there's no way we'll ever know, but what percentage of the population is that fucking awkward?

Is he that fucking awkward, and also so bad at guessing people's ages that he could legitimately mistake a guy two years my senior, who doesn't have gray hair or a beard or wrinkles or any of the marks of even middle age, for my father? I mean, even if he is bad at ages how young could he possibly think I was - 16? - even then, to have a 16 year old kid you're going to be like, 36. Minimum.

He wanted to know if my brother was my boyfriend. But if he said "Is he your boyfriend," it would be even more stunningly obvious that he was trying to hit on me. He probably knew it would be inappropriate. So instead he blurted out the next platonic role a male might have in my life, "father."

______________

It's a potential lawsuit because if the employee has a history of customer complaints/acting inappropriately, and Goodwill has been informed of incidents like this and knowingly ignored them, they're liable for his pattern of behavior which starts to look more like sexual harassment with every additional woman he's sexually awkward to. It's a potential lawsuit if he's got a history of this pattern of behavior, as evidenced by background checks or similar, and Goodwill hired him and put him in a situation to continue it anyway.

It's a potential lawsuit because employers are liable for the behavior of their employees, particularly when they're on the job, and definitely absolutely if they've been alerted to that behavior before, or time and time again.

If a customer feels an employee behaved inappropriately towards them, I guess the most correct option is to raise to management and let them decide. It seems that's what they're doing here.

I feel like if I were an employer, I'd want to know if a customer felt uncomfortable. If it was spurious I could dismiss it. if it was small, maybe I wouldn't address it right away - but I'd at least have a little heads up there might be a problem down the line.

____________________

Honest answer: I hate getting hit on, especially by strangers, certainly by strangers who work at Goodwill, and definitely by people who I am forced to interact with repeatedly in the future (who I can't avoid because I have to go to the places they work) regardless of how I receive their advances.

Don't hit on someone who will be forced to interact with you in the future because they go to your establishment for business purposes. You're just making it fucking awkward for everyone. It's rude.

Again, I'll reiterate what I said to flag: this is a weird experience for me because I am so not a part of what is occurring as a direct result to how I was treated. On the other hand, if I were alone and went to that Goodwill and the guy asked me if I had a boyfriend, I wouldn't want to go back there for quite a while without someone else along. Because it would feel weird and I wouldn't like that attention.

I don't mind talking to strangers. But when a stranger hits on me, someone I've never talked to in my whole life before, I feel gross. When someone who doesn't know you hits on you, it's not a compliment - they literally don't know a thing about you, let alone whether those things interest them. Think about it. "Hey, it's me, a total stranger who felt so compelled by the symmetry of your features and the size of your bod that I couldn't leave you alone to do whatever you're out in the world doing without intruding upon it and making my attraction to you known!"

Now, there's flirting. If you're cute and you're subtle and there's a reason for your interaction, you can flirt with a stranger. But that reason should be something like "She dropped all her groceries and I stopped to pick them up" or "He grabbed the last Coke Zero right when I reached for it!" and flirting is done with no intention. A flirt understands he will probably never see you again, and that's life, but in this moment you're kind of cute so he wants to make you smile. He doesn't care if you have a boyfriend because he's not trying to date some stranger he ran into in the produce section at Acme. He has a life. He has a way to meet women. Or she, whatever.

Too long, and full of fucks, and ranty. But as a woman, I know a guy hitting on me when it happens. And the thing I know just as well as "getting hit on" is "guys telling me I wasn't getting hit on because the person wasn't literally telling me he wanted to date me."

Conversation has two levels; Text, subtext. The text of his question was "Is that your dad?" The subtext was, "Are you single? I'm interested."

steve  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    Honest answer: I hate getting hit on, especially by strangers

Wait... but I was TOTALLY hitting on you in Philly that time we met...

(I kid... I kid...)

Bummer about the whole situation.

oyster  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

So I deal with this stuff a lot, probably since I was 13 and there's a lot of subtle things men do that make other men think well wait crap that seems harmless, what if I did that and it was misread. The thing is you wouldn't. There's making small talk and then there's making one comment out of nowhere plus body language plus ignoring the woman's obvious body language. What I've realized as I've grown is that they aren't ignoring the body language at all. You wouldn't continue to stare at a woman who looked extremely uncomfortable but some men would because making that woman feel small is their goal. Then there's the difference between looking and leering which often times men think well it's only leering if the guys unattractive. Except no, looking = friendly, possibly flirty and thinking the woman looks interesting or attractive while leering = wondering what the woman asshole tastes like, it's weirdly violating.

A lot of the time we brush off the uncomfortable feeling, try and laugh it off then carry on with our days. I've been doing that since I was very young and I hate thinking about it. I hate when it happens to other woman who remind me of younger me.

Here's an example: a guy at the bar wouldn't stop trying to get me to do a shot with him the other night even after I said no I have no idea who you are go away multiple times and keep in mind I've transitioned from polite to bitchy in these encounters. It was easy for me to be bitchy because I'm friends with a lot of people at the bar however if I wasn't I would have felt very uncomfortable. Now any guy who has ever offered a girl a drink in a bar is remembering that and relating to this guy so they're thinking whoa whoa whoa slow down, what if people thought that about me ? Well would you ever argue with a woman who said no first off ? If so would you say something like are you sure once while smiling or would you get more aggressive in how you were looking and start whining for her to just do the shot with you multiple times ?

I wrote this all out because I think since other woman get it so quickly we expect the same of men. I've realized we really can't though because men can't just understand how woman experience life if we don't fully explain it so when somebody seems open to understanding I like to take that opportunity.

_refugee_  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

in this subthread: 95% men telling women that surely, the woman's wrong (and if she's wrong, exactly how terrible it's going to be for the man as a result, with the implication of oh how bad she should feel)

You know what I have learned from lots of years dating and not dating lots of guys? A whole lot of them will say whatever they think is needed in order to get the girl they're talking to to go home with them. I've had guys hit on me by telling me they're not hitting on me.

And everyone gets so hung up on informing the woman that surely, she was wrong, she's overreacting, she's misconstruing, that the real problem, which is that she felt really uncomfortable, (uncomfortable at best) gets completely glossed over.

It's real funny too that the woman goes "That was uncomfortable, I didn't like that" and prepares to dismiss the interaction for the most part but when a dude is involved, he goes "That was uncomfortable, his behavior was inappropriate, and I'm reporting it immediately to management."

oyster  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Dude, society even does that to rape and sexual assault victims. The fact that our culture makes woman feel bad for somehow ruining mens lives by reporting things men do is ridiculous. Then of course the cherry on top is the well why don't woman report things ? My favourite has to be that you're getting a man fired due to your brother's actions. Damn woman and our mind control powers.

Quatrarius  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

am i able to question you without losing my woman card because i gotta say i really do need this card

AnSionnachRua  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

This is living up to the American reputation of suing for everything.

thenewgreen  ·  2639 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I couldn't agree more.

Edit: to be very clear, in no way do I think _refugee_ is wrong for being annoyed, pissed or disgusted by unwarranted flirtations, or being unwantingly "hit on." However, I do think we are way too litigious as a society and that which can be sorted out socially, ought to be.